Overheating
Roger Harmon
Expert Adviser
One week the truck is fine, the next it overheats -quickly.
I pulled the thermostat: it's full of dirty cotton seat padding. I set the thermostat aside, fished out all the cotton I could and reassembled. I checked the radiator; some scale. So I mixed up ten packages of lemon-lime cool aid, poured it in, ran it to temp and let it sit overnight. I flushed it out with clear water and it's clean as a whistle. Even the bits of cotton I'm still fishing out are white! Still overheats. I pulled the water pump; clear. I flushed the block backwards and forwards. I flushed the radiator backwards and forwards. Still overheats. I think I must have a wad of cotton padding somewhere that I can't get to.
I am thinking of trying some (pipe-safe) drain cleaner to break it down. Has anybody ever tried this? Do we already know it's a bad thing to do, or am I the one to find out and post it here?
Suggestions welcome.
R/ Roger.
I pulled the thermostat: it's full of dirty cotton seat padding. I set the thermostat aside, fished out all the cotton I could and reassembled. I checked the radiator; some scale. So I mixed up ten packages of lemon-lime cool aid, poured it in, ran it to temp and let it sit overnight. I flushed it out with clear water and it's clean as a whistle. Even the bits of cotton I'm still fishing out are white! Still overheats. I pulled the water pump; clear. I flushed the block backwards and forwards. I flushed the radiator backwards and forwards. Still overheats. I think I must have a wad of cotton padding somewhere that I can't get to.
I am thinking of trying some (pipe-safe) drain cleaner to break it down. Has anybody ever tried this? Do we already know it's a bad thing to do, or am I the one to find out and post it here?
Suggestions welcome.
R/ Roger.
0
Comments
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Roger Harmon wrote:
What year and model, 6 or 8. Walt.One week the truck is fine, the next it overheats -quickly.
I pulled the thermostat: it's full of dirty cotton seat padding. I set the thermostat aside, fished out all the cotton I could and reassembled. I checked the radiator; some scale. So I mixed up ten packages of lemon-lime cool aid, poured it in, ran it to temp and let it sit overnight. I flushed it out with clear water and it's clean as a whistle. Even the bits of cotton I'm still fishing out are white! Still overheats. I pulled the water pump; clear. I flushed the block backwards and forwards. I flushed the radiator backwards and forwards. Still overheats. I think I must have a wad of cotton padding somewhere that I can't get to.
I am thinking of trying some (pipe-safe) drain cleaner to break it down. Has anybody ever tried this? Do we already know it's a bad thing to do, or am I the one to find out and post it here?
Suggestions welcome.
R/ Roger.0 -
Walt,
The truck is a 46, the engine is a narrow '50 Pacemaker 232.
R/ Roger.0 -
Is your ignition timing set right with a timing light, and does your distributor vacuum control work?0
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Rod,
I set the points with a dwell meter and the timing with a vacuum gage. How can I check the vacuum advance?
R/ Roger.0 -
Low tech vac. adv. check is to remove line from it, install a scrap piece of 3/8 line with a piece of vac hose and suck on it and watch for plate movement. If it draws very easily, diaphram is gone.
I've heard stories of pump inpellers beng loose on the shaft and not moving water or moving at different rpm than shaft as a result of not having a tight enough fit. Try your spare pump.
Just an amatuer's observation.
Kim0 -
I think I recall something (in WTN?) about a rusting water distribution tube. Or maybe I am getting senile.
BN0 -
Roger Harmon wrote:
You can have a water pump impeller that is to far from the back plate. Impeller is supposed to be about 0.012 above the housing. Second, remove the water pump and pull the water distribution tube out of the block and inspect for rust or rusted away area at the rear. 2 reason for overheating. My tech tip books explains all this, and more about overheating. Like others say, timing and a lean carburetor helps overheating. Walt.One week the truck is fine, the next it overheats -quickly.
I pulled the thermostat: it's full of dirty cotton seat padding. I set the thermostat aside, fished out all the cotton I could and reassembled. I checked the radiator; some scale. So I mixed up ten packages of lemon-lime cool aid, poured it in, ran it to temp and let it sit overnight. I flushed it out with clear water and it's clean as a whistle. Even the bits of cotton I'm still fishing out are white! Still overheats. I pulled the water pump; clear. I flushed the block backwards and forwards. I flushed the radiator backwards and forwards. Still overheats. I think I must have a wad of cotton padding somewhere that I can't get to.
I am thinking of trying some (pipe-safe) drain cleaner to break it down. Has anybody ever tried this? Do we already know it's a bad thing to do, or am I the one to find out and post it here?
Suggestions welcome.
R/ Roger.0 -
How did the cotton get in the cooling system. I would not put any drain cleaner into the block, it can be pretty corrosive to cast iron. I think you may be right though, you still have something that is occasionally blocking the flow. If you put pressure to the bottom hose and it doesn't flow well out of the top you have an obstruction. If I found cotton batting in my cooling system though I would make sure I flushed it well. You may have to pull the head to find it though.
Harry0 -
billn34 wrote:I think I recall something (in WTN?) about a rusting water distribution tube. Or maybe I am getting senile.
BN
I don't know if you are getting senile, but a rusted and clogged water distribution tube is very likely part, or all, of the problem.0 -
junkcarfann wrote:I don't know if you are getting senile, but a rusted and clogged water distribution tube is very likely part, or all, of the problem.
Where is this tube you speak of (on a 232), and how do I access it?
R/ Roger.0 -
A lot of the old flatheads (Chrysler products had them also, if I remember correctly) have a tin tube that is perforated that runs along inside the block from the front to the rear.
The purpose is to take water from the area of the water pump that is under water pump pressure, and carry it down the length of the block, so as to evenly distribute water to the rear cylinder areas.
Over time, the tin rusts, gets clogged, falls apart, etc., so parts of the water passages in the block do not get a flow of water, and thus the engine overheats.
I have never done one on a stepdown six, but on some other brand flathead 6 I remember pulling off the water pump, and pulling what was left of the tube out the front of the block. And then fishing out the rotted parts, flushing, fishing some more, etc, etc.
The radiator has to come off also.
Perhaps someone else who is more familiar with the stepdown engine can help you with the exact particulars on the 232.
Good luck.0 -
As Rick has stated;
"Cotton batting? Was this engine, radiator, etc., in storage someplace, before it was put into the truck?"
This has been my experience in the past. Mice have made a "Hotel"in the upper tank. Unless you backflush it,it will never come out,just pack itself harder into the cooling tubes. Try backflushing with air and water[special tool]. At this point it might be wise to pull the radiator, take it to the radiator shop and have them remove the upper tank and inspect it better?. as mentioned,it is probably in the block as well. Good luck0 -
Roger Harmon wrote:
Remove the water pump and radiator. You will see a small metal flat against the block where the pump was removed. Very carefully straighten it out, use a body shop vise grip with a 2 inch jaw, lock it on that flange and pull straight out and you may have to tap it with a hammer a little. Do not bend as you pull. This is called (water distribution tube) if you have to look for a replacement. New one are not being made. Walt.Where is this tube you speak of (on a 232), and how do I access it?
R/ Roger.0 -
I have been skimming your heating dilema but see You have had some very good Tips already and I echo them by taking the radiator to a shop where they can flush it and tell you if it was plugged or not. Pull the water pump and remove the rear cover to look for erroded impeller, slipping shaft (doubtful), wadding, correct distance, etc.
At that point You may be able to take a pen light to look into the distribution tube to see if it is clean to the rear, but the best way is to grab the 'tab' then pull it straight out and check the holes that squirt coolant to the valve areas. Most tubes I seen were open and ready to re insert. Be sure your timing is correct, fan belt tight, and your gauge is accurate by using a cheap kitchen cooking thermometer.
There are many safe Automotive coolant flushes on the market today that will not harm your gaskets rather than using hardware corrossive Drain cleaner.
I have found on my Truck with a 262 that you must ensure all the baffling is in place because of the narrow grill opening compounded with fog lights.
I actually added 'additionall' coreboard' panels with wire tyes underneath and along the sides to ensure all air flows through the radiator and not over or under the radiator. On a 90' day it runs 185 in traffic.
Lastly, if recoring the Radiator install a modern pressure system since originally they are not pressurized....
Good luck0 -
Thank you all.
I'm going in after the water distribution tube (family permitting) this weekend. I'll keep you posted.
R/ Roger.0 -
Roger Harmon wrote:Thank you all.
I'm going in after the water distribution tube (family permitting) this weekend. I'll keep you posted.
R/ Roger.
"(family permitting) . . ." Why does that sound so familiar?:D0 -
Well, I got the radiator out, the water pump off. and with some effort, the water distribution tube out. The best news is that it's brass, so no corrosion! There was a little stuff in it; some o-ring pieces, some crud and a little cotton stuff. It's all clean now. Next I took the back off the water pump; all good. I put it back together with the last of my number 2 permatex. I then turned to the radiator; I removed the drain cock, turned the radiator upside down, ran the garden hose into the (usually) bottom fitting. When it was full of water, I had herself push the blow-gun (hooked to the air compressor) onto the draincock hole and pull the trigger. At the same moment I took my hand off the filler hole (now at the bottom). BOY, did we get some stuff out of the radiator!! After a dozen repeats we looked in the top tank through the filler: Amazing! I didn't know the radiator tubes were that big! We kept it up until no more stuff came out. I am now confident that the radiator is clear, the water pump impeller is not slipping and the distribution tube is clear (and intact). Sadly, I didn't get to put it back together; I'm now out on number 2 permatex and have no new gaskets. Besides; I need to replace the center-steer bearings and it's a lot easier to get to without the radiator and water pump in place. I did get the big bolt to turn, but had to stop and light the grill: The kids are coming over to eat and they are bringing friends with them. I oiled the he!! out of the big center-steer bolt, and will pick up a tube of number 2 on the way home from work tomorrow. I don't know when I'll get it back together, but I'll let you all know as soon as I give it a good test. I have a good feeling though! Thanks for listening.
R/ Roger.0 -
My question is: How did these vehicles NOT run hot in traffic back in the
'40's & '50's ??0 -
I'd like to get a basic question, what do you have for a radiator?
If you have the original radiator it was made to cool a 212 cu. inch engine, not a 232. You might also install an elec. fan in front of the rad. to push more air thru (had to do that with an 1/8th over Hornet engine in a '52 H cp.).
One of the big problems at one time (still?) was guys putting Hornet engines into trucks & expecting the original radiator to cool the 302 engine WHICH IT WOULD/WILL NOT DO. This put a premium on the 8 cyl. radiators avail. at the time as it would "bolt in" & provide sufficient cooling. Last '46-7 PU I had I drove to the Indianapolis National with a big camper on it. Had NOS '56 Hornet engine, NOS 8 rad., & NOS O.D. trans. - ran fast & cool from L. A. to "Naptown" & back so check to see what radiator you have in it, OK?0 -
Old Hudsons,
Good piont. I think this radiator came from the doner that gave up the 232 because of the creative radiator mounts on the bottom, but how do I tell one radiator from another?
R/ Roger.0 -
Roger - the 8 cyl. models used a 3" core I believe; measure yours & see what it is.0
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Well I'll be; it's a three inch core. I hope I can get it back together before Sunday.
R/ Roger.0 -
I believe the lead in the gasoline helped with the cooling.0
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I think that rmcfhudson is right. Leaded fuel burns.runs cooler than our modern unleaded. Also the 8 cylinder radiator is a 4 core and the big 6 is a 3 core. When recoring radiator,I always opt.for the extra capacity, but 3 core seems to work fine though. Also as Ol racer stated, make sure that you have all the shroud/sheet metal completed around the radiator. This will insure the maximum amount of air travels thru the radiator and not around it. It does make a difference. I would put an actual temp.gauge in it instead of depending on the dash gauge. The temp.sender for a big 6 will not correspond correct with the trucks temp gauge. Good luck,sounds like your on the road to cooler days!!
0
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