Old Tire Danger
I have been reading about this issue for some time and had not really took it seriously, but old tires that look new look like can kill you. This is an especially tough thing for us old car guys that do not put many miles on our tires every year and the tires look pretty new w/ lots of tread. I guess I need to rethink my situation. This 20/20 segment was pretty interesting:
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/aged-tires-driving-hazard-4826897
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/aged-tires-driving-hazard-4826897
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Thanks Dan for this report, I have new tires on Chrysler wheels waiting to put on my '50 Commadore. Bought these tires 3 years ago, I will check these tires age this week end. The Tires on the '50 are 28 years old.0
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I have a '64 Hawk w/ "new" tires put on in 10/93 and they look great, but maybe that is not so great?0
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Gauging by this, I am a huge risk taker! I bought some Allstate wide-white tires for me Terraplane in the late '70's and only replaced them about ten years ago. The tread was still good but they had all sorts of age cracks. (Now I'm wondering about my "new" tires!) Still, you have to wonder: just how prevalent is this old tire failure? How many tires per million, fail because of old age? Does the actual use (in terms of mileage) come into the calculation? Does it make sense to play it safe and replace your seldom-used antique car tires, at a cost of maybe $500, every 6 or 7 years? Points to ponder...0
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Our Suburban had tires with 80% tread and less than 5 years old. On a trip to Arizona we had a tire sidewall blow out. The Suburban went out of control, hit and rolled over the divider and ended upside down in the fast lane of oncoming traffic. And that was only at 55 mph pulling an empty car tote. It was a serious accident but it could have been fatal. Fortunately none of us were seriously hirt.
I may be wrong but I believe most tire manufaturers recommend tires be replaced every four years. Regardless of how they look.
When I had my wheel alignment shop, I would often see tires that had lots of tread and the outer sidewalls looked ok, but the inner sidewalls would have serious major cracks. So don't forget to check the backside of the tires.
Also, the valve stems are often over looked. Bend them over, if there is any sign of a crack replace them. Sometimes they will break off when you do that. They are suppose to be flexable but over time they become hard and brittle. Better it happen in your driveway than out on the road.
Or a customer will only look at part of the tire with lots of tread and be blind to the part of the tire with little or no tread left, and think his tires are ok. However, tires will wear just as fast or faster on the thin tread as with lots of tread.
Then there is the inside of the tire that deteriorates which can not be seen as well as many other factors that affect tire life.
Keep tire pressure up. Low tire pressure and bad wheel alignment are the biggest killer of tires.
Have a good day. Lee0 -
I think the radial design has a lot to do with the failures. I have had old "I MEAN OLD Like 20 yrs." bias ply tires that the tread actually fell off, but the carcass held air long enough to pull to the side of the road. radials seem to fail catastrophecly (sp?) I've lost several on motorhomes that had less than 14,000 miles but were four to five years old. They don't go down slowly! More like "BOOM"!! Seems like a shame to have to throw away what appear to be good tires, but if it saves a life or two or saves wrecking the car.. So be It..0
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This is an intresting subject. I fear that it has a subject life much like talking about oil. There may be some merit it it but then again how much of it is hype and salesmanship. I do not fully understand how rubber wears; and have not made an indepth engineering evaluation of tires. I know that one of the major factors in rubber wear is the sun. The other is chemical exposure and wear and use.
For a point of discussion, I found a 1960 El Camino in a rock garage with hard packed dirt floor and no windows or light inside what so ever.. The tires were installed in 1966--High end SBR tires. I removed the car in 2006. Documented less than 2000 miles on the tires and forty years sitting above the ground with the car on blocks. I wanted the car judged so last year I bought a new set of bias ply tires. The tires that I took off were in perfect shape. Not a single crack or sign of wear anywhere. I gave the tires to a friend who now has them on his car.
Since we often drive our cars at 55 or below my advice on this subject is to inspect them often and keep them treated with products that protect them from the sun. Once I see a subjective report that is made by someone other than a news broadcaster I will reconsider my opinion.....0 -
Browniepetersen wrote:Once I see a subjective report that is made by someone other than a news broadcaster I will reconsider my opinion.....
Though it leaves a lot of technical details out I think that this report to congress has a good bit of information that shows the source of the dangers.
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/staticfiles/DOT/NHTSA/NRD/Multimedia/PDFs/Crashworthiness/CongReptTireAgingFinal080907.pdf0 -
Thanks for the report. I found it good reading, however, I found any decision of the life of a tire to be inconclusive just as I expected. Below is a quote from section seven of the report that basically says they need more money to determine if they can figure out what their testing is telling them and if it has any thing to do with the failure of a tire under stress. I stand by my previous post.
"At this time, NHTSA’s research supports the conclusion that the age of a tire, along with factors such as average air temperature and inflation,
plays some role in the likelihood of its failure... However, the
agency must take additional steps before it can have a sufficient understanding of the aging phenomenon to support any possible safety
standard or consumer recommendations on the issue. Additionally, necessary cost and benefit analyses have to be performed before making any regulatory decisions."0 -
We just had a discussion on the AACA website re this. Radial tires do deteriate differantly than bias ones. Age makes a differance. So does underinflation and I mean not just at the present time, but underinflation causes wear to the thin walls on radials on a cumulative basis. In hot climates tires rated C are more at risk than tires made for the extreme climate, as the belts get hot and seperation can occur. Happened recently to a friend. And what about trailer tires. Hate to see an airborne Hudson. I had a valve snap off my trailer tire on I-20. When I got home I checked the other 3 valves. 2 broke off in my fingers. I also suspect the durability of collector car tires. So I keep my speed below 55-60. I prefer not to use radials on my collector cars, because of the sudden failure issues and the little use the cars get that might contribute to failure.0
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Regardless of the rubber ageing contraversy, as far as safety and drivability, modern quality radials are simply superior in design and manufacture to any bias ply tire. Don't know of many (like none) modern race or police cars with bias ply tires. I agree that there maybe some questionable collector car tires outthere. It may be romantic to love bias plys but safer and better handling? Not possible.0
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There are some car shows where they are a bit snippy about having the right tires for your car. If you have one of these cars.. as below, you go the bias ply route. The tires and rims behind the counter are going on my 39 "Martz" roadster. But you can see that the ElCamino has to have bias ply tires...0
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This thread reminded me of my dad's 27 a few years back. He bought the car in 66 I think. It had the same tires on it until around 2000 or so, and there's no telling how old the tires actually were. The car spent most of the 80's in a garage with a bad flywheel so no miles were put on it for a good 15 years. In the mid 90's my brother got it going again, and my dad started driving it often. One summer, (2000 I think), the car had a blowout on the way to a cruise night. The tire literally disintegrated. The spare was installed and within a week did the same thing. At that point my dad bought a new set from Coker. Luckily, the car really is never driven over 45mph so there was no damage or injury, but it definately made us all think more about tire age.
I guess I'll have the same problem, my "New" tires are 5 years old and have 3K on them0 -
I've got a set of Goodyear Eagle ST tires on my '66 Coronet that I had put on in 1992. The car they are on, has always been in a garage when not driven, and been exposed to sunlight only when the car has been on the road. I've always paid attention to proper tire inflation and rotation. The tires now have maybe 10K miles on them, and have zero cracking or other aging problems. I drove the car last weekend over 250 miles, at speeds between 60 - 75 mph. The tires rode like new.
As pointed out previously, age alone is NOT the only contributing factor in tire failure. I've had brand-new name-brand tires self-destruct with less than a thousand miles on them!
Sure, age IS a factor, but so are so many other variables.0 -
Sunlight, heat, water and air, are the four factors in a tyre (our spelling!) deteroriating. Generally, if the tyre is kept on a wheel, inflated, and not exposed to sunlight or heat, it will last indefinitely. I'm talking here about the good old-fashioned cross-plies as fitted to our cars originally. Other factors leading to failure have been referred to - under or over inflationj, bumped sidewalls, etc. but if they are kept cool, in the shade, and not let go flat with weight on them, they will last indefinitely. I bought a 40-year-old 640.15 for my Jet at a swap meet 15 years ago. It had been bought for a trailer in 1955, by the vendors father, but never puton. it had been kept in a cupborad in his basement all those years, and never been exposed to sunlight. I did 30,000 miles on that one, and then took it off and had it recapped (yes we can still get that done here), and it is now awaiting it's turn to be put back on the car. Conversely, when I rebuilt my first '29 Hudson in '72, I bought a pair of 650.19's that had been stored for years in a loft in a local garage, right under the roofing iron. they looied fine, but after a thousand miles the treads had all split open exposing the canvas - a result of being exposed to high heat all those years. Water will rot the inside of a tyre, and they will blow out. But by and large, if you take sensible precauitons with cross-plies, they will last a very long time, but there is unfortunatelyno guarantee. My two-bob's worth!
Geoff.0
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