Can the 308 be sleeved ?? Bad Wrist Pin Retainers

brumac
brumac Expert Adviser
edited November -1 in HUDSON
With 170 miles on my freshly rebuilt 54 308 a seriously sounding non rhymthic noise presented itself. Teardown revealed the wrist pin lock rings had left their grooves in # 3 and 6, broken into pieces and severly damaged the cylinder walls and pistons. A third lock ring in #4 was found to be out of it's groove and headed to the cylinder wall. The block is presently at 0.040" over and does anyone know if installing sleeves would work or should I find another motor?



I feel I must report that the pistons were purchased from EGGE by the machine shop. The owner wouldn't listen that Dale Cooper had all that was needed and in stock.



Although I am no longer a professional mechanic, I have rebuilt, make that assembled, many engines, I was at first going to blame myself for not seating the lock ring fully, but as this has happened with two more pistons, I now blame the lock rings supplied by EGGE!!! Beware guys. I am sick !!!!



Please respond on sleeving the cylinders and what problems I may encounter.



Thank you,



Bruce

Comments

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    For the cost of sleeving you may be able to find another block to rebuild.
  • Ol racer
    Ol racer Senior Contributor
    FYI

    You can have it sleeved or bore to .060. I also recommend Dale's pistons but if your Egge's sre ok measure the thickness of the 'wire retainers' then install spiraloc retainers. I use Spiraloc's even on street motors.They probably are .052 available at Chevy Dealers and most speed shops....
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    brumac wrote:
    With 170 miles on my freshly rebuilt 54 308 a seriously sounding non rhymthic noise presented itself. Teardown revealed the wrist pin lock rings had left their grooves in # 3 and 6, broken into pieces and severly damaged the cylinder walls and pistons. A third lock ring in #4 was found to be out of it's groove and headed to the cylinder wall. The block is presently at 0.040" over and does anyone know if installing sleeves would work or should I find another motor?



    I feel I must report that the pistons were purchased from EGGE by the machine shop. The owner wouldn't listen that Dale Cooper had all that was needed and in stock.



    Although I am no longer a professional mechanic, I have rebuilt, make that assembled, many engines, I was at first going to blame myself for not seating the lock ring fully, but as this has happened with two more pistons, I now blame the lock rings supplied by EGGE!!! Beware guys. I am sick !!!!



    Please respond on sleeving the cylinders and what problems I may encounter.



    Thank you,



    Bruce
    308 blocks can safely be bored to 0.080 over. Jack use to bore blocks 0.125 over for drag racing. 308 cylinder walls are thick. I'm at 0.060 and no problems with heat as long as you have a good radiator. Walt.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Does anyone know who makes the pistons sold by Dale Cooper? Maybe Egge?
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Ol racer wrote:
    FYI

    You can have it sleeved or bore to .060. I also recommend Dale's pistons but if your Egge's sre ok measure the thickness of the 'wire retainers' then install spiraloc retainers. I use Spiraloc's even on street motors.They probably are .052 available at Chevy Dealers and most speed shops....



    Ol racer,



    How is the sleeve sealed off from coolant at the valve relief area? Do they fit that tightly in the block? I have a 308 with a crack from the #4 cylinder to the exhaust valve seat and was wondering if a sleeve would make the block useable again.
  • Ol racer
    Ol racer Senior Contributor
    Dave, I had a lot of blocks repaired using different measures. Talk to your machine Shop for options. I have a block sleeved then bored to .125 with aluminum head with no problem after 3 yrs of cruising. To sleeve, a block is bored the OD of sleeve then pressed in, then rebored to piston Size.



    The most popular crack repair is drill & instalLthreaded taper pin then bore flush. Sometimes a valve seat insert needs installed too.. If crack is high at seat there is no water until aprx 3/8" down anyway...(We diesected a blowb block to determine action long ago). I could insert a picture if need...



    Suggest typing in repairing flathead cracks and read they seldom ever toss away a block because of cracks, however, If your racing a Motor maybe should consider crack free block but repaired cracks in street cars have never been problem even back in the old days...
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Bruce,



    I have a 308 from a '51. It is 90% rebuilt with rings, bearings, guides, etc from Dale Cooper. It has original pistons -- not oversized -- because the motor was in such good shape to start. Sounds like a possible solution to your predicament. I am going to scrap the car I intended it for -- a 51 Pacemaker coupe -- and so am not using the motor.



    I live 90 minutes north of Buffalo, 30 minutes north of Hamilton Ontario, so only a few hours drive for you.



    Let me know if you're interested. I'm pretty flexible on the price.
  • Uncle Josh
    Uncle Josh Senior Contributor
    This is serious. That's the 2nd ruined block I've heard of using the Egge retainers. The other was a couple of years ago on a 28 Essex. Same thing, they came out and ruined the block. Fortunately he was able to find another block.



    Somebody should get on Egge and tell them to get the correct retainers or stop supplying them. Seems they had a square cross section instead of round but I could be mis-informed on that.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Are you getting any help from the machine shop or Egge? If one or the other put the engine together there should be some sort of warrenty, or are they not helpful?
  • brumac
    brumac Expert Adviser
    Geoff,

    Thanks and I will keep you in mind. I have another fellow with some 308's much closer that may work out for me. If not, we will be talking. Please send me your e-mail. Mine is [email]hudbrumac@peoplepc.com and you know what to do with the hud part.



    Eddynghdsn16,

    I assembled the engine. The 1'st shop was a disaster and bought me the Egge pistons, not Coopers like I wanted. He ground the valves down deep into the ports and screwed up the guides. I wouldn't take a bicycle there! Thankfully I had put a good size magnet in the oil pan and it collected just about all of the particles. It looks like a Phyllis Diller hair do. The crank, rod and main bearings look good with no apparent damage as well as the cam and lifters. The magnet came from a small Harbor Freight welding magnet with the side plates removed.

    I have not contacted Egge as yet. I tried to get oversize wrist pins from them when the 1'st shop screwed up the fit, basicly all I encountered was a run around.



    I've gotten a rough quote of $400 to sleeve 2 cylinders and then I'll need 2 pistons, rings, gaskets, etc. Close to $1000 and that's hard for a retiree to swallow just now. Yeah, I am still sick.



    Thanks guys,

    Bruce[/email]
  • Unknown
    Unknown
    Bruce, Sent you a pm with contact info.

    Cheers.
  • Ol racer
    Ol racer Senior Contributor
    FYI

    What ever you decide be sure to dissemble the oil pump and the oil pan pickup screen then rinse clean.
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