6 Volt or 8 Volt Battery

Browniepetersen · February 2011

I am having a difficult time with the engine on my Hudson. It is an 8 cyl and is just broken in. The engine seems to have a hard time starting with the 6 volt system. Just wondering if I should go with an 8 volt battery? Every thing in the system is new with the exception of the starter motor that I plan to take off next week and have rebuilt?

What are the pro's and con's for the six or the eight?

[Deleted User] · February 2011

I had trouble with mine and found 2 problems....
#1 Had dirty contacts on battery cables and battery also on dist. wire connections
Make all connections Clean and Tight!

#2 My battery was good but did not haave enough cranking amps...It was 550 cca. I bought a new 6 volt battery from interstate batteries with 800 cca and have no problems since.

Just MY experience...
Bob Hickson

[Deleted User] · February 2011

You said "Everything in the system is new" , did someone sell you new battery cables that are to small? The 12-volt modern ones are too small diameter to work properly,
Roger

Jon B · February 2011

Amen, to Bob's battery suggestion. What are you using nowadays? Having the extra oomph of a lot of cold cranking amps, sure helps turn that starter (AND gives you the extra "spark" for ignition). I myself have a DEKA Group II 6-volt battery with 780 CCA (this is the old style lead-acid battery). The new Optima "gel" batteries have 850 CCA, though they are fairly pricey. And it sounds like the Interstate packs a wallop as well. Some of the less expensive tractor batteries may be cheap, but they also have piddling CCA. Tractor Supply's batteries are down in the low 600's, I believe.

It takes so much to turn over the starter on a good, tight 8-cylinder, that there isn't that much left over to light the spark plugs!

Park_W · February 2011

I have a '47 C8 that has had somewhat the same problem. Had the starter gone through, then for good measure put an Optima battery in it. Now all's well with the world. In my view, 8v batteries fall into the category of "compensating for the problem instead of fixing it."

(BTW, the Optima's hidden in a vintage Willard case ... expensive, but works like a champ and looks original).

Marconi · February 2011

By all means, DO NOT USE AN 8 VOLT BATTERY! ou wll just cause yourself more problems down the road. Repair what's wrong with your 6 volt system and make it right! Start with a battery with enough capacity, use cables designed for a 6 volt system, make sure you have all the necessary grounds installed- Pos cable to engine block, block to frame, frame to body. And last but not least make sure all connections are CLEAN and TIGHT! remove all corrosion, rust, paint and whatever else gets in the way of good current flow. One place that's overlooked quite often is between the starter and the adapter plate and bell housing. I've seen so much paint in this area that a voltmeter between the starter and block read full battery voltage! Totally insulated. When everything is clean and tight, they start very well on 6 volts. Good luck.

[Deleted User] · February 2011

Walt here. Do not use an 8 volt battery unless you have generator and voltage regulator reset. Leaving it set at 6 volts will just run the 8 volt down to 6. Get the highest amp hour battery, and make sure you have Number one (1) battery cables made for 6 volts with ends soldered on not screwed on. I make these cables and all say what a difference. Cables are 1/2 inch thick and can carry the amps starter needs.

50C8DAN · February 2011

Last year the guys on NPR Car Talk, Click and Clack had a guy with a ’39 Lasalle call in that apparently had called in about a year before. Apparently they had told him to use an 8V battery to help his car start, well in the latest call the guy once again had a problem starting the car even with the 8V, surprise surprise. As noted if you run the 8V without doing something about your gen and regulator the 8V battery will become a 6V battery! They ended up telling him to get his starter rebuilt!!!!! I sent an email saying they were all wet, but never heard a thing. The guy is probably still pissed off that after he got his starter rebuilt it still has a hard time starting. BTW he said it was all original, including the battery and starter cables. Click and Clack would do well to stick to something ’70 or newer.

Park_W · February 2011

Another no-no to avoid is use of stainless steel bolts and washers in fastening any part of the battery-to-starter circuit. Or any other electrical circuit on the car. I've not asked a metalurgist or chemistry prof to explain it, but have seen a couple of really dramatic examples of resistance being built up in stainless steel connections.

[Deleted User] · February 2011

Interstate Batteries has a type 2, 6 Volt that has enough cca to get the job done and costs much less than the Optima Gel Battery. I think mine was somewhere around $80 and the Optima was around $140. Sorry Jason, the Interstate is in my coupe, I bought a NAPA type 2 shown in photo,for my sedan. 8 volts only hides the problem till it gets worse.....

Bob Hickson

SamJ · February 2011

As mentioned in a more learned post than mine, BP, the correct cables and clean terminals throughout, esp ground are paragmount. Dave Kostansek sells the correct gauge and length of cable for your car. Every time I post that I've had success with an Optima battery somebody else posts that they suck. All I can say is that it's the best thing I've ever done for my car, esp since it needs a low-profile battery under the flip-front hood. My 6-volt optima has lasted longer at full cranking power than any battery I've ever owned in any vehicle, making the premium cost worth it IMAVHO. My car had been sitting for about a month when I fired it up last weekend in +1 degree weather. That strong cranking sound is soooo reassuring...B)

Park_W · February 2011

The Optima seems ideal for a collector car that's not driven much, as the Optimas don't lose their charge over time nearly like a lead-acid "wet" battery. And they're not damaged by sitting around with a low charge condition as a conventional battery is. But I have to agree they're a bit pricey.

Hudson Grandpa · February 2011

I Agree with what Marconi and the others say.
Wasting your money on 8 volts. I even had my starter redone so that it had more cranking power, but didn't help. The voltage reg would have to put out 9 1/2 volts to keep it charged. 8 volts on your system is still 6 volts. Make sure all connections are clean and preferably new to your car year specs.
My collector car has a 6 volt Optima, with a 6 volt alternator. I drive it at least 3-4 times a week, and I have yet to put the charger on it.

RonS · February 2011

Ditto to above. BTW do you have a green wheel battery kill switch, or any other type? These tend to be current bottlenecks. OK on 12 volt,not 6v.

forjack842 · February 2011

On my 29 Sedan I went and installed #4/0 positive and neg directly from the battery to the starter plus added 1 1/2" wide ground strap from bat to frame and starter case to frame. Installed an Optima 6v. Been running her up on that without any cranking or spark problems. Keep the optima on a trickle charger when she's sleeping in the garage.

SamJ · February 2011

In the March April WTN (due to be mailed March 15), Walt Mordenti reviews the 35 Hudson and writes; "All 212 engine models use the National 17-plate battery, while the eight-cylinder cars use the Exide 19-plate battery. This is where owners of 8's today make a big mistake...they install the wrong battery and as a result don't have enough cranking power."

[Deleted User] · February 2011

I'm NOT putting the Optima battery down because they are an excellent product. I am just saying that there are other choices that for me were more affordable.
Bob Hickson

SamJ · February 2011

A few years ago I found a new low-profile conventional battery that fit under the hood of my '40 without welding itself to the underside. It wasn't cheap, and it lasted 3 years before it was toast. (prior to that I'd used Volkswagen 6V units, which were totally unsatisfactory) I don't know if anybody makes this class of battery now, but I can't find one. I know what it means to enjoy this hobby on a budget, believe me, but by my calculation a battery that costs $80 and lasts 5 years costs the same as a battery that sells for $160 and lasts 10 years. This is just for me, though. I'm in no position to judge other people's choices...:)

Marconi · February 2011

Don't want to bad mouth Optima batteries, but my experience with them is that in a car that gets used often there's no problem, but with a car that seldom gets used, they go dead and can't be brought back sucessfully. Maybe I'm diong something wrong? Everyone seems to have good luck with them. They seem to have plenty of capacity when in good shape though.

Geoff · February 2011

The Optima batteries are like Nicads, if they go flat they need a good kick in the guts to get them back up. In other words, you need to initially give it at least 14 volts on a 6 volt battery to get it to start to recharge. Only for about 20 seconds or so, to break down initial resistance, then charge it on the normal 6 volt charger.
Considering the performance capability and the life of a battery, it pays to buy the best. Unfortunately Optimas are priced beyond consideration here in antipodes, but I have had good performance from 6 volt deep-cycle forklift batteries, the last one I had lasted 11 years.

Marconi · February 2011

Thanks for the info, Geoff, that's what I've been dong wrong. Hook up a 6 volt charger and turn it on and walk away for an hour!

Browniepetersen · February 2011

SamJ wrote:

In the March April WTN (due to be mailed March 15), Walt Mordenti reviews the 35 Hudson and writes; "All 212 engine models use the National 17-plate battery, while the eight-cylinder cars use the Exide 19-plate battery. This is where owners of 8's today make a big mistake...they install the wrong battery and as a result don't have enough cranking power."

We have a National Battery dealer in town so today I drove down to have a set of new cables made. In talking batteries we looked at the old specks to see what would work best. The book showed that the 6 volt batteries of 1936 had just over 450 Amp power. (it is the Amp's that give that extra power when starting) the suggested size of 6 V battery today has 720 Amp. I plan to use the battery our of my 1950 Hudson until I get the starter motor rebuilt and then I will see where I need to go from there. National has a battery that is about one inch higher than my recommended battery that has 840 Amp. I need to measure and if it will fit I might go with that. By the way, my car has had all of the wiring replaced on the car. This should work....

6 Volt or 8 Volt Battery

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