Dry Clutch
Anyone here converted a stepdown from wet clutch to dry clutch? I am looking into it with my friend who is an old time tranny guy. I understand the Hash's had a dry clutch behind the 308 but I need to look more into that. I think this could be a great upgrade considering the limitations of the wet clutch and dwindling parts availability.
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Comments
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What limitations???
The Hudson wet clutch, properly maintained, will give excellent service. I think the hesitation to work with it these days is because most are so used to cars (built today) that damn near fix themselves!!!!! If you are going to own a 1950's, or other early years, car - then you have to put your mind and thoughts to that time period. Follow the maintenance routine in the owners manual and also get a shop manual for your car. Pre-1960's cars, at the very least, are a lot simpler than todays cars and most are fairly easy to work with - relative to the time period, ie 1920's cars are simpler than 1950's cars are simpler than 2000 cars, etc.
Hudsonly,
Alex Burr
Memphis, TN0 -
The only limitation to the Hudson clutch is it needs to be used. You can't park it for six months at a time and not expect to have it stick.
Here in our local we have an elderly guy who was a cab driver in the 40's. The cabs of course ran 24 hrs a day. The only ones he say's they NEVER put a clutch in were the Hudsons,
Roger0 -
464Saloon wrote:Anyone here converted a stepdown from wet clutch to dry clutch? I am looking into it with my friend who is an old time tranny guy. I understand the Hash's had a dry clutch behind the 308 but I need to look more into that. I think this could be a great upgrade considering the limitations of the wet clutch and dwindling parts availability.
Historically the wet clutch has been used as the heavy lifter for automobiles and construction equipment. Wet cork clutch systems have been used in fork lifts for decades.
Several Hudson club members have assured that the components of the HUDSON unique wet clutch system are available to those who require repair parts, overhaul and complete swap out of thier car's clutch mechanisms.
A dry clutch conversion for the Hudson is available from
Wilcap Company
P.O. Box 763 Pismo Beach CA 93448
(805) 481-7639
FAX (805) 481-9367
EMAIL pmcguire@wilcap.com
A Hudsonite from Florida has this conversion in his Hudson behind a 308 motor. in 2010 he and his Dad drove from Florida to Austin Texas to attend the Lonestar Roundup without any maintenance difficulties.
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464 saloon, if you were to tackle the project, you should consider going for a flywheel thicker than that of the stepdown's wet clutch system. Either machine one up or maybe transpose a flywheel and crankshaft from a manual 308 Hash.
The reason for that is the potential for flywheel heat distortion, a wet clutch runs a lot cooler than a dry clutch, so you can use as the stepdowns do, a relatively thin flywheel.
Did Hudson have rocks in their head introducing a new car in 1948 with a wet clutch? Of course they did, but that wet clutch will serve you well if you look after it. Although if you are up for the challenge of a dry clutch conversion, it will be an interesting project to take on.0 -
FYI
The 308 Wet clutch worked perfectly night after night for Stock Car Racing & ocassional Drag Racing until added a 1/2" Stroker Crank with 12" Slicks and only then did it slip. Most Modified Racers back then would adapt a 'Ford Clutch & Transmission' to their Hornets.
However, I converted my wet Clutch by removing the corks, then rivited lining to the discs, installed heavier springs inside the pressure plate, then put 'spacers' between the pressure plate & Flywheel. It worked good until the Trans Input shaft twisted off, which was the next weak point, and why others used a Ford Set-up.
My point is if you eliminate the Wet Clutch that holds to 329", you may as well install a stronger Trans too...0 -
The Hudson clutch is/was the smoothest in the industry. As durable and good as Chrysler's fluid drive. Has it been dome? yes. But Hudson had that same clutch even prior to the step-down era way back to the '20's. Just keep the fluid changed and you should have no problems if it was put together right in the first place.
If you are thinking of doing some hard-core racing applications though I dunno maybe you want a dry clutch but I have no experience in that department.0 -
Having worked as an industrial mechanic in the past I am quite aware of wet clutches and there advantages. My thing here is that if it was so good, why didn't anyone else use it and why did they change to a dry clutch in 55? With the Jet even earlier. One has to ponder the thought. With all the clutch technology you see out there now, none of it is wet, at least not for cars. Another thing is parts availablity and the only two people that I know that rebuilds them. I looked at what Wilcap has and forwarded the info to my buddy. Looks so far like we can go with their parts and a Chevy trans with the OD. Should give the appearance of stock but will be stronger with more available parts. Now I wonder why I am trying to stay with the 308 :silly:0
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464Saloon wrote:Having worked as an industrial mechanic in the past I am quite aware of wet clutches and there advantages. My thing here is that if it was so good, why didn't anyone else use it and why did they change to a dry clutch in 55? With the Jet even earlier. One has to ponder the thought. With all the clutch technology you see out there now, none of it is wet, at least not for cars. Another thing is parts availablity and the only two people that I know that rebuilds them. I looked at what Wilcap has and forwarded the info to my buddy. Looks so far like we can go with their parts and a Chevy trans with the OD. Should give the appearance of stock but will be stronger with more available parts. Now I wonder why I am trying to stay with the 308 :silly:
why didn't anyone else use it - There are a couple that did use a form of it - the Chrysler fluid drive and, I think, the Buick Dynaflo was another version. Hudson used it for so long because it worked for one thing and Hudson was, well, different. Tho Hudson used it long before the 1940's, by that time everybody was looking at automatic transmissions - everybody except Hudson and even they had forms of it (DriveMaster, SuperMatic).
why did they change to a dry clutch in 55 and with the Jet even earlier? - Different company; AMC was using Nash technology and they also were using the GM hydramatic, as was Hudson. As for the Jet I have no idea - but the answer is probably they would have had to engineer a whole new wet clutch for the Jet models which would have been cost prohibitive.
Hudsonly,
Alex Burr
Memphis, TN0 -
Wet clutch is very smooth- I really like mine for a couple of weeks after putting in Hudsonite, before the juice leaks out and it starts "shuddering" again on start-up. I could fix it, of course- but I've never liked a column shift, and my OD needs to be completely gone through before I'll have a good "road car" (I've had it to 65, but engine sounds much more comfortable below 60. I, on the other hand, am much more comfortable at about 75 on the freeway).
So I've got a T5 Borg Warner 5 speed (5th is overdrive), a Chevy bellhousing, and Wilcap's phone number to get the kit together.
Why didn't the wet clutch catch on? Because its just something else to maintain, and repair.
BTW, Alex, the Buick Dynaflow didn't have a clutch, as far as I know- at least, no clutch pedal, just a variable stator fluid drive. Acted like an automatic transmission, except for the slippage, of course. Will always remember the vision of a friend in college, driving his '50 Buick up a steep alley in Pullman, WA- technique was to floor it, and then be patient as it crept up the hill. He was an engineering major, and nicknamed his car "The Vector"- because it had magnitude and direction.0 -
He was an engineering major, and nicknamed his car "The Vector"- because it had magnitude and direction.
HA!
Someone owes me a dry keyboard!
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Wilkap has relisted the manual adapter (MT350) in their catalog (it was absent for a while). When I called them last year they said that they could still build them but it was obviously no longer an regular process. Maybe renewed interest by Hudson owners has made them relist the application. It took 4 months to get mine, partly because I also had them make up a 10.5" clutch for a S10 T5 (not available from GM or aftermarket). I ordered the starter as well. The flywheel is stout, a lot stronger than the original '54 standard flywheel I have. At the risk of drawing criticsm, I purchased parts to install a Jet dry clutch onto a 308 flywheel/pressure plate and it all looked pretty whimpy to me. Also, the '55 dry clutch trans used different levers and a torque tube, a lot of stuff to consider for only a 9.2" clutch!0
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Well my buddy has done some research on it and we are going to meet up today to go over what he thinks. Though I am not crazy about the column shift, I want to keep the car origional appearing so I am going to stay with it. So hopefully that part will make things easier. It is looking like a later Chevy trans is what the adapter is for and my buddy said we can make the overdrive work on it. The time is not a big deal, the motor is out getting work done and it is going in for paint hopefully this week. Will be kind of nice having it away from me for a while so I can work on some of my other projects 0
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I say he should convert... to driving a Jet!0
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LOL nice one.0
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