GIBSON-BINKS speed equip.

greenhornet wrote:

I see that this thread was started early in the year and was picked up again recently. Whatever happened with the flow testing experiment and the molds for the two piece head? I am an engineer also and would love to know 'the rest of the story'.



P.S. I am not that far from Crossville and could assist in the flow test, or at least stand in the room and look dumb.



Hal

Greenhornet, send me a message and we'll try to hook up. The flow testing hopefully will get back on track soon. I've been overly occupied with things anti-Hudsonly this spring/summer.



Where in Tennessee are you? I'm in Red Boiling Springs



My e-mail hudfarm@nctc.com



Mark

Went back to the desk top dyno and stroked my 7X by .250 to 4.750 stroke with by 3.905 bore. I come up with 341 cu. in.--two more cubes than your 339. At 3500 RPM results:







323 cu. in 3.905 bore stock stroke 217HP 325Torque

341 cu. in 3.905 bore +.250 stroke 225 HP 338Torque



Randy

maasfh wrote:

Went back to the desk top dyno and stroked my 7X by .250 to 4.750 stroke with by 3.905 bore. I come up with 341 cu. in.--two more cubes than your 339. At 3500 RPM results:







323 cu. in 3.905 bore stock stroke 217HP 325Torque

341 cu. in 3.905 bore +.250 stroke 225 HP 338Torque



Randy

Randy,



Throw these numbers up for view from your Desktop Dyno. I don't have one anymore.



3.880 bore 5.00 stroke. Use your "Hot Cam" spec. Individual runner induction @ 525 cfm, with headers and pocket porting. 9.75 compression. I don't know how you simulated a weber setup in your calculations, but that is what I'm shooting for.



Then just for kicks, do the same specs with the exception of 4.250" bore and 625 cfm.



Mark

7XPacemaker wrote:

I believe it was "Big Daddy" that said it. I don't have a Chevytop dyno, Nor do I race an 8 1/2 X 11 piece of paper that hypothetically shows me what I should have. I never did see at what RPM these figures were at. The problem with these programs are that that they have to be too generic. Can you calculate the distance of the intake runner and the angle of flow from the intake to the valve? A simple modification such as this can alter horsepower. Example: Put a 4.0 liter AMC head on an early model 258. The only way to TRULY know is to build each engine and put it on a dyno. I stated earlier that it depends on your application- this still stands. Multiple sidedraft carbs and such are great- if you can get them to run right. desktop dyno doesn't consider this. I remember at the Cleveland HET national a multi carb setup in a '41 got beat in a heads up drag by a modestly built jet with a 308. Also, more CFM is not always the answer. smaller cfm will sometimes produce more torque than a larger cfm carb. These engines don't like RPM too much, so I keep mine fairly modest and run a standard twin H. Most people don't want to spend the money stroking a Hornet engine. They do what is most cost effective. If you think that boring a hornet engine doesn't change much- come to Doc's meet this spring and I'll show ya first hand, but don't spill your coffee on my interior and save the doughnuts for after the ride! Now, its time to quit playing deerhunter on the computer and try the real thing in Pa. EVERYBODY HAVE A GOOD THANKSGIVING!

Actually, my whole goal is to eliminate the speculation and actually run the stroker in on a dyno. I'm also kinda tired of paper-tigers and want to know the facts rather than the best educated guesses. That being said, the engine dyno software is an excellent tool in comparing setups in advance to help decide such things as cam choices. Money well spent ahead of actual hard purchases. The non-chevy engines I've built over the years weren't exactly like the computer simulation, but close enough to see how the comparisons ahead of the build were benefited by the time spent with the software.



And yes, there is an engine design software out there that takes into consideration the runner length, and has port tuning simulation. Right down to the pressure wave harmonics through the intake tract. The name of the program is Dynomation, its about $500.00. The deal is, the more you know about your engine, the more you can simulate. The more real, hard numbers you can plug in - the more accurate the simulation is.



I'm going to agree on modestly built engines being on par with "over the top" engines in most cases - but only because the state of tune and knowledge of the tuner. I've been on both ends of that stick.



I'm also understanding of the cfm situation. The weber outfit I have will be matched to the flow number of each respective cylinder, and the vacuum signal at the jet will also be known. I was told a long time ago that each barrel of the weber outfit had to be tuned to its respective cylinder and I intend to take that tuning right down to the last variable - cfm capacity of each cylinder.



Maybe, we should sponsor a Hornet engine shootout - sure seems to be alot of us messing with these engines these days. I know the location of a dang good dyno facility.



Mark

there is a good (well decent) drag strip in Muncie which is south of Alburn

off of interstate 69. It's about 1 to 1-1/2 hours from Auburn. Its a easy drive

especially since its 4 lane for all but the last 4 or 5 miles.

they race on saturday's from april thru november.

i plan on taking my pacemaker there as that is the track we normally run

thru out the year.

They have 1/8 mile for the box bracket 1 cars and 1/4 mile for the no-box

bracket 2 cars and the street cars.

It would be cool to get five or six Hudson drag racers to meet up and go there saturday.

They usually open the gates between 11-12, start pratice at 1 and begin

eliminations at 5:00.

I do know the guys that run the track and I can contact them to see if they would let us Hudson guys race against each other in a special class. I've seen

the track manager do special things like that before. Personally i perfer 1/8

mile over 1/4 any more. its much safer in my book especially with vehicles

this old even though they are mechanically new.

I already believe Dany would be up for it. Any other's that may be interested?

PaceRacer50

Great= and looking forward to run. Do you run your hudson there on a regular basis? Muncie is about a 5 hr. drive from where I live in Illinois. Would like to meet up with you during the spring & summer since we like to travel to different tracks. I assume you live fairly close. Maybe Mark will have something together by the Nationals that he can bring at that time. Hopefully other Hudson hot rodders will bring their ride also.

Randy

PaceRacer50 wrote:

Any other's that may be interested?

One Jack Jockey volunteer right here. I can change an Indy tire in 8 seconds including the time to hit the start and stop buttons on the clock. Did some light tire swapping and gas passing' for a local truck racer in Indy a few years back. I know my daughter would love to see this as well. She'll gladly get dirty changing from street to track slicks and back in exchange for some driving tips and maybe a test run.



I am working hard to keep the Nationals inked into the schedule.

turkey wrote:

seasons greetings

i fell across this chat while tryin to find out about engine mods for my 1917 huson super 6 . the porting isnt great as the early engines has the carb on the opposite side to the valves ,with passages through the block into the ports . standard they made 75 bhp @3500 and the team cars managed 115 bhp.

the valve guides have been cut down to help flow and 2 carbs . the cam is being re profiled but what else can be done ? compression is about 5-1 , would dome or wedge pistons be an advantage ? would stroking from 288 to maybe 360 be possible ? im only lookin for 120-150 bhp.

how much of this hornet info would be of use ?

cheers, james

Have you been over at Yahoo Groups Hudson Super Six 1916-1929 ? More of the older Hudson chat over there. Good Luck, Ron