Electrical gauge issue

Hudson Grandpa
Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
edited November -1 in HUDSON
Hey guys.



54 Hornet cpe. New gas tank gauge, and temp sending unit gauge installed. Won't work.

ON the wiring schematic you will see a voltage regulater positioned either in between or on top of the two gauges in the instrument panel, which incidentally are almost impossible to see from underneath. One wire #6(black & Red) power, goes to the ignition acc pole from the voltage regulator.. What is the purpose of the (small) voltage regulator, and do I have to pull the dashboard off from the top so I can get my hands down in behind the instrument panel to determine what I am dealing with? Don't throw your hands up in horror, theres more..



Direction Indicator............................



Some yahoo in the past miswired all of the wires that come out of the harness from the turn signals into the junction block. I finally got all the wires sorted out by color, put new bullets on them, and re inserted them in their proper holes as per the schematic. Got power to the flasher. Flasher new....The turn signal lever does cancel. Thats about it. I have running lights, brake lights, no turn signal lights...Somebody please come and shoot me and put me out of my misery!!!!



ARRRRRGH!!!!!!

Comments

  • Park_W
    Park_W Senior Contributor
    You can see the back side of the gauges and the little regulator pretty well on the pre '54 cars by removing the radio speaker grille and speaker. Try that ... the '54 instrument cluster isn't located exactly the same relative to the speaker hole, but it might work.



    The voltage regulator stabilizes voltage to the instruments at about 4v, to keep them from reading differently as the supply voltage changes, such as being 6v with the engine not running and a little over 7v with the generator putting out. First thing I'd do is run a test by grounding the wire that attaches to the sending unit (i.e., use a jumper wire to go from the sender terminal to a bare spot on the frame somewhere), then turn the key on and see if the gauge swings to a FULL reading. Don't let the needle peg out for more than a couple of seconds ... turn the key off to prevent that. If the gauge did behave as described, then it's OK, as is the wire back to the sender. If that's the case, try making sure the sender housing is grounded properly ... run a wire from one of its mounting screws to a bare spot on the frame. If that doesn't correct it, you've got a bad sender. There are folks who rebuild these, or you can by a new one from Dennis Carpenter (Fords used the same sender)
  • Jon B
    Jon B Administrator
    Let's start out with the basics:



    1. Are you sure you have power to the turn signal switch?



    2. This power comes on when you turn the ignition switch on, right?



    3. A question: the Hornet has separate lamps for the turnsignals? Or do the brakelights and the turnsignals share the same filament of one lamp? There were two different arrangements, depending upon the model of Hudson for that year; did the Yahoo perhaps buy and install an incorrect switch for your model? If you have separate lamps for the signals, then the switch should only have maybe 3 wires coming out of it; if a 'shared' switch, it has maybe 6 wires.
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    Jon B...Thanx



    #1.Yes



    #2 Yes



    #3 1156 bulbs on tailights. Two filaments. 6 wires coming out of turn signal switch. Now two things just came up. I drove the car tonight, and used the turn signal switch. When I pull down on the switch the little turn arrow lights up only once, but on the right side. When I push the switch up to go right the little turn arrow light, lights up once, but on the left side. Couldn't see what was happening in the rear. The other thing is in looking at the schematic, the flasher is mounted to a frame with a clamp and a screw. Does that mean that the flasher has to be grounded to work...? The one in this car is just floating free with wires attached to where they are supposed to go.
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    Park W.



    I wll try everything you suggest. How about a jumper wire from the temp sending unit on the engine to the frame. A little easier than climbing under the car for the gas tank...Thats second.
  • Jon B
    Jon B Administrator
    If the switch has six wires, I assume it is sharing a bulb filament with the stoplight. So the next question would be: when you're NOT using the turnsignals, are both rear brakelights functioning correctly? Are both brakelights of equal intensity? If they seem dim, try grounding the sockets by running a long wire directly back from the socket, to the proper battery terminal. Does the light get brighter when you do this?



    By the way, if you don't have a spare person to watch the taillights, you might try backing the car up against the garage wall or inside of the door, so you can see the reflection of the red light bouncing off the wall or door.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Make sure the tank is well grounded. When I took my tank off and had it sealed, I couldn't get the line back onto the pickup tube. I cut the line and put in a short piece of rubber line. Everything was back in place, but, Now the gauge didn't work! It made me crazy....Finally I figured out that the tank wasn't grounded because of the insulator pads under the straps that hold the tank in place. I ran a wire from one of the screws that hold the sending unit in place to the body......Gauge now works! Hudson used the gas line to ground the tank to the frame.
    For the Turn signals, the 54 Hornet used one dual element bulb for the stop/turn and running lights. As far as getting them to work, I spent 2 weeks under the dash of my coupe and still do not know how I got them to work but they do work...Sorry
    Bob
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    Park W.



    Guess what!! Took the wire off the temp sending unit. Hooked a #18 wire to the spade end and then to ground. Turned the key on and needle went to full right. What can I say....You guys are fantastic...Got the temp unit from NAPA, and still have receipt. Monday the car goes up on the rack, and then I will do same with tank sending unit. So problem is they have to be grounded.

    But how did Hudson do this in the beginning?



    As to the turn signal...THe car has to be running. Now when I turn the switch down to the left I get a light front and back. No flash. Same to the right.....So do I have to dive into the switch in the steering column...?
  • Jon B
    Jon B Administrator
    Did you check the operation of the brake lights (without activating the turnsignals)?



    Which flasher are you using?
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    BJ



    Thanx for your reply.



    I got a suspicion that I have the same problem...I grounded the temp gauge and it worked. Temp sending unit either no good or I have to ground it too.



    I think I have to ground the tank, as there is material between the straps and the body, plus rubber fuel line hose I think out of the tank sending unit.
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Hudson Grandpa wrote:
    Hey guys.



    54 Hornet cpe. New gas tank gauge, and temp sending unit gauge installed. Won't work.

    ON the wiring schematic you will see a voltage regulater positioned either in between or on top of the two gauges in the instrument panel, which incidentally are almost impossible to see from underneath. One wire #6(black & Red) power, goes to the ignition acc pole from the voltage regulator.. What is the purpose of the (small) voltage regulator, and do I have to pull the dashboard off from the top so I can get my hands down in behind the instrument panel to determine what I am dealing with? Don't throw your hands up in horror, theres more..



    Direction Indicator............................



    Some yahoo in the past miswired all of the wires that come out of the harness from the turn signals into the junction block. I finally got all the wires sorted out by color, put new bullets on them, and re inserted them in their proper holes as per the schematic. Got power to the flasher. Flasher new....The turn signal lever does cancel. Thats about it. I have running lights, brake lights, no turn signal lights...Somebody please come and shoot me and put me out of my misery!!!!



    ARRRRRGH!!!!!!



    Dave



    There are two things that are differnet about the 54 Signal light circuit when compared to the earlier stepdowns. There are pilot lights for each side as well as a different flasher. The flasher used in the 54 is designed to have a higher load factor than the 53 and earlier systems. It needs that load to work. Are the pilot lights working? They are in the insturment cluster. The flasher unit should be a small rectangular unit that looks like a circuit breaker.



    Pilot lights need to work and the signal flasher needs to the correct type.
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    Ken:



    Yes the pilots are working. I now get a light on in the front left and the left rear when I pull the switch down for left. Same for right.. Engine has to be running. Thats parking light and tailight. They do not flash. I have running lights and brake lights.

    I am looking at the 4D-5D-6D-7D Direction indicator arrangement schematic.

    C-C diagram, and it shows a round flasher with a female and male spade connector. The new one I have in there is exactly what I took out.

    tung-sol A 229S 6 volt. I also tested the old one in the circuit and had power to it. Someone suggested clean contacts in the switch in the steering wheel. That should be fun... Now did they slip in a change of flasher for the 54 without updating the schematic? If so then I hope someone can come up with the #, and I'm sure NAPA has it......I have an 8 volt battery in the car, and a new voltage reg which is finally working great.....
  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User]
    Grandpa, If you are using the two wire flasher, It needs to be grounded. There should be a U shaped clip on the brace behind the steering column that the flasher snaps into, grounding the flasher case.
    Bob
  • Hudson Grandpa
    Hudson Grandpa Expert Adviser
    BJ:



    Thats been bugging me also, as it looks on the schematic exactly as you have explained it. This one has been hanging free, so I will remedy that situation and get back to you.



    Thanx
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