Hash Carb
![[Deleted User]](https://openforum.hetclub.org/applications/dashboard/design/images/defaulticon.png)
Well alright now. I may be making headway. I had a friend come over today to we could both check things as they were happening. To recap the problem. My carbs have been acting up and I don't have a top end when accelerating, lately I haven't had any power. I noticed to that the front carb was leaking gas from the vent hole on the high speed jet, also if I held my hand over the front carb the engine didn't choke out but it did on the back carb. So the front carb is the problem, I took the plug off the high speed jet on both carbs and noticed the front carb jet is twice as deep in the orifice as the back carb. In the back carb the jet seats against a shoulder, that looks like a brass tube. The front carb appears to be missing the tube and the jet goes in twice as far. I believe the jet should stop so that the vent hole is even with the four orifices on the jet. Does any body have an idea on what is missing in the carb that the jet should seat against?
Harry
Harry
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Comments
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OK if I understand you this is part of the carburetor you are talking about. Now what is missing?
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That's not the correct view Mars55, on the engine side of the carb where the accelerator pump pushes the fuel is the high speed jet. The accelerator pump pushes the fuel past a check ball and into the high speed jet. The jet seats against something in the threaded portion that keeps it from going to far into the body of the carb, the jet has a hole going through it, part of the way along the jet are four holes that I believe should line up with the vent hole in the side of the carb, the problem is the jet goes past the hole so fuel comes out the vent hole or sucks too much air in through the vent. The jet in the back carb stops at the correct location, the jet in the front carb goes in to far.
Harry0 -
Tomorrow I'll try setting the jet to the correct depth in the passage and see if that makes a difference in how the car runs although I believe there should be something that stops the jet from going past the correct depth.
Harry0 -
The part I'm talking about is number 48-74 in the WA manual, aka the pump jet, mine is seating to far into the carb body.
Harry0 -
OK it sounds like this is part of the carburetor you are talking about. Now what is missing?
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Mars55; okay, that's the picture I'm looking for. Look at the Air bleed on the pump jet. In the channel the jet screws into there should be something to stop the jet from going past the air bleed. Instead my jet screws in past the airbleed so the fuel leaks out the airbleed and at high speed the air jet bleed is a source of air so the front three cylinders run very lean and starve for fuel. I believe there is a brass or bronze tube that should stop the jet at the proper height that is missing.
Mars55, I don't know if I've told you thank you for the help you are giving on this problem. it is greatly appreciated.
Harry0 -
I think your Pump Jet is broken. I believe the brass or bronze tube you speak of is part the Pump Jet and it is broken off. You should remove the Pump Jet from the carburetor to check. A picture of a Pump Jet, labeled 48-90, can be seen on this web page right above "N" in Note.
http://tocmp.com/manuals/Carbs/Carter/ServiceUniveral/pages/p_%2024_jpg.htm0 -
Nope, it's all in one piece. I took a drill bit that is the same size as the vent hole and put the jet in until the bit slipped in at the shoulder. So I know the jet is in to the correct depth, I can look in the throttle body and see the end of the jet is flush with the throttle body wall. I have to do a search but I believe the jet should be .180. If everything is right then there isn't any reason there should be gas squirting out the vent hole. Unless I have a intake valve sticking open but that should show during a compression check. I'll check the jet again to make sure it is clear all the way through.
Harry0 -
It should not be possible to screw the Pump Jet in too far. There is a gasket on the Pump Jet. Is this gasket missing? Also inspect Air Bleed passage for damage, like stripped threads or cracks.0
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I don't see a gasket on either pump jet. Is it an o ring? Where does it go. There isn't gasket shown in the schematic.
Harry0 -
Harry Hill wrote:I don't see a gasket on either pump jet. Is it an o ring? Where does it go. There isn't gasket shown in the schematic.
Harry
The gasket maybe on the plug. Still it should not be possible to screw the Pump Jet in too far. Inspect Air Bleed passage for damage, like stripped threads or cracks.0 -
Mars, what I'm not sure about is why gas is coming out the vent hole when the accelerator pump pushes fuel into the jet. I should have measured the depth of the jet before I removed it so I would know if I was right about it being too deep. If you know the jet bore let me know please and I can check it tomorrow to make sure it is open enough.
Harry0 -
FWIW---I just dis-assembled an old core from a WA-1, did NOT find any o-ring or gasket for the pump jet. It seats on a taper, looks to me. Pump jet looks to have a number 74 stamped on it, too.0
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bigboy308 wrote:FWIW---I just dis-assembled an old core from a WA-1, did NOT find any o-ring or gasket for the pump jet. It seats on a taper, looks to me. Pump jet looks to have a number 74 stamped on it, too.
That is correct, the discharge jet sits on a taper. Check that the balls are in place as in the diagram, otherwise fuel will discharge from this jet all the time, and the pump will not work, resulting in a flat spot upon acceleration, and high fuel consumption.
Geoff.0 -
Geoff;
the balls are in place. I still have the flat spot on acceleration and high fuel consumption and the fuel leaking out the vent hole. Someone answer a question on the jet orifice. Should it be a constant size all the way through the jet?
Harry0 -
Looking at the previous picture posted of the pump assembly, if your jet is seated too far down, it may be that the air bleed hole is covered , which would allow vacuum to lift the check ball and draw fuel constantly. It could be that the seat has disintegrated or crumbled somehow, allowing the jet to seat too deeply. The purpose of the air bleed is to allow the pressure inside the pump chamber to be less than in the throat, hence the ball check will be seated, stopping fuel flow until pressure is applied by the pump piston. You need to examine under the jet and see what has happened. If it has collapsed, then the carby is u/s.
Geoff.0 -
Was'nt gonna get back into this as I think staying on one track gets the job done, too many ideas to check out leads to confusion, BUT, I would like to ask both Geoff and Mars {they're sharp guys} IF the jet seat is deteriorated and that is his problem,could he put a fiber washer under it to make it seat higer up ? Likely have to trim one to fit.0
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Well, yes, maybe, a washer under the jet seat might fix it. It's hard to know what to do without seeing the part. I have no idea how badly the pump jet area is damaged. My suggestion is get another carburetor or at least another carb body.0
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mars55 wrote:Well, yes, maybe, a washer under the jet seat might fix it. It's hard to know what to do without seeing the part. I have no idea how badly the pump jet area is damaged. My suggestion is get another carburetor or at least another carb body.
SO TRUE, very difficult to work on something you don't have your hands on. Mars has done a great job here. Another carb is not really that expensive when you consider what you've allready invested, and then also you know it'll last longer.0 -
37 Terraplane#2 wrote:Was'nt gonna get back into this as I think staying on one track gets the job done, too many ideas to check out leads to confusion, BUT, I would like to ask both Geoff and Mars {they're sharp guys} IF the jet seat is deteriorated and that is his problem,could he put a fiber washer under it to make it seat higer up ? Likely have to trim one to fit.
It may be possible, but as mentioned, it's hard to make a judgement without actually inspecting the area concerned.0 -
Guys, I can't see the shoulder in the jet passage, I can in the other carb. It appears that someone may have drilled out the passage and then tapped it all the way through. Not sure why someone would do that but it is not surprising with everything else wrong I have found on this car. When I got it one carb was completely disconnected, fuel line and everything else and the guy couldn't figure out why it didn't have any power. It seems they may have messed up a carb then unhooked it because it didn't make any difference. I will try it with the jet set to the correct depth but I think the jet should set against the shoulder in order for the vent to work correctly and not let in too much air. If this doesn't work then I think I'll need to find another carb body to try, or a whole new carb. It would be best if I could find another carb to try to see if this is the problem.
Harry0 -
Harry that is what I originally suspected and at this point whether that is all your problems or not does'nt really matter, some dummy ruined your carb, it may have other problems also. You can play with it if you like but in the end I'd go with the other guys and get another rebuilt carb. Not really that hard to find, the guys will help you locate one.0
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I think that is the answer also. It seems someone who knows even less than I do decided to modify the carb before I ever got it. This no top end problem has been with the car since I got it going. When I first rebuilt the carbs I wondered why the one jet went in so much farther than the other. I will know more when I try it with the jet at the proper depth but right now I'm in the market for a WA-1 968S.
Harry0 -
Good decission Harry, since you have new parts in it a rebiuldable core will be all that you need. Start a new thread for a rebuildable core or rebuilt carb wanted and watch one come up real quick !!0
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And remember Murphy's law - "If you fiddle with something long enough, it will ultimately break".0
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I have one more thing to try before I give up on this carb. I have the carb back on and still have the same problem. The carb still won't choke out and the car only runs slightly better with the jet reset to the correct depth. I'm going to switch carbs and see if the same carb has the problem on the back half or if the back carb has the problem when I move it up front. Just in case there is a manifold leak I'm not finding. If it is the carb it will be equally bad on either part of the manifold. If it is the manifold then the front carb will act up no matter which carb is there. When I originally got the car it was the back carb unhooked and that leads me to think it is carb related as I didn't pay attention to which carb I put in which position when I put the carbs back on. I can honestly say that whoever designed the engine compartment on the 55 never worked on an engine with it in the car. Those towers are in the way of anything you try to do, great idea, bad execution.
Harry0
This discussion has been closed.
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