Dual Range Hydra-matic woes

SuperDave

Working on a friends 54 Hornet.

Problem:

Upon first start up, cold. 1-2 shift delayed for at least a 1/4 mil. same with 2-3 shift. After about 1/2 mile, all shifts work, but slightly delayed. After it's warmed up it shifts fine all day even if left undriven for several hours.



All other functions are fine WOT, kick down, reverse, etc.

Corrective actions taken:

Fresh fluid and clean filter..no change.

Removed pressure regulator, cleaned in lacquer thinner, flushed with fluid and re-installed. Shifts are a little bit more harsh when warmed up, but acceptable. Still no improvement on the cold start up.

Now what?

Any Gurus in Florida?

super-six

It sounds like the symptoms that mine had. The lip seals were hardened from age. They would soften somewhat when warmed-up, and the shifting would return to normal. Replacing them solved the problem.

[Deleted User]

SuperDave wrote:

Working on a friends 54 Hornet.

Problem:

Upon first start up, cold. 1-2 shift delayed for at least a 1/4 mil. same with 2-3 shift. After about 1/2 mile, all shifts work, but slightly delayed. After it's warmed up it shifts fine all day even if left undriven for several hours.



All other functions are fine WOT, kick down, reverse, etc.

Corrective actions taken:

Fresh fluid and clean filter..no change.

Removed pressure regulator, cleaned in lacquer thinner, flushed with fluid and re-installed. Shifts are a little bit more harsh when warmed up, but acceptable. Still no improvement on the cold start up.

Now what?

Any Gurus in Florida?

Don't fool around, the unit is ready for an overhaul. Walt.

SuperDave

I think I'll order the kit from the guy in Needhan MA. I'm fairly certain there aren't any broken parts, just hardened seals as Larry suggests. I was wondering if there was anything i should look at specifically when I have it apart. The lip seals are certainly required to keep pressure in the system. This will be my first Hydramatic OH. Besides not letting the pieces hit the floor and remembering where everything goes.. Any tips or encouragement are welcome.

RL Chilton

Best tip I can offer, Dave, is get a Hydramatic Manual, if you don't already have one.



And speaking of Hydramatics, why is it that they don't need to have their fluid cooled? I know they are "early examples" of automatic transmissions, but has anyone retro-fitted a Hydro for better cooling, longer life? Or do they really not need cooler fluid?

SuperDave

RL Chilton wrote:

Best tip I can offer, Dave, is get a Hydramatic Manual, if you don't already have one.



And speaking of Hydramatics, why is it that they don't need to have their fluid cooled? I know they are "early examples" of automatic transmissions, but has anyone retro-fitted a Hydro for better cooling, longer life? Or do they really not need cooler fluid?

I Do have several manuals, can't find my Hudson one though. Except for the suppliment to the 53 manual that covers the changes for 54.. I have a great one by Chilton, that covers the dual coupleing offered in later years.Wish I had the earlier version.

..there used to be several aftermarket pans that were finned to aid in cooling. They were popular "in the day".

I maybe braze some fins or tubes on the original pan to help.

mdwhit

RL Chilton wrote:

Best tip I can offer, Dave, is get a Hydramatic Manual, if you don't already have one.



And speaking of Hydramatics, why is it that they don't need to have their fluid cooled? I know they are "early examples" of automatic transmissions, but has anyone retro-fitted a Hydro for better cooling, longer life? Or do they really not need cooler fluid?

Hi Russell,



Just wanted to respond to your question on why the fluid does not need to be cooled - Ans: because there is so much of it, it really does not get as hot as the trannys that have a smaller fluid capacity. I could be wrong, but that's what I have been told, and it seems to make sense (at least to me...).



Michael



PS I still owe you an e-mail and some pictures, and intend to do so soon!

RL Chilton

Michael-



That's as good an answer as I've heard yet, and makes sense. Hope to hear from you soon.

464Saloon

SuperDave wrote:

Working on a friends 54 Hornet.
Problem:
Upon first start up, cold. 1-2 shift delayed for at least a 1/4 mil. same with 2-3 shift. After about 1/2 mile, all shifts work, but slightly delayed. After it's warmed up it shifts fine all day even if left undriven for several hours.

All other functions are fine WOT, kick down, reverse, etc.
Corrective actions taken:
Fresh fluid and clean filter..no change.
Removed pressure regulator, cleaned in lacquer thinner, flushed with fluid and re-installed. Shifts are a little bit more harsh when warmed up, but acceptable. Still no improvement on the cold start up.
Now what?
Any Gurus in Florida?

Sorry you are so far away. One of my best friends here in So Cal has a tranny shop and he can do anything. He is one of the few left around that will work on Hydro's. Most shops don't even know what one is anymore.

[Deleted User]

mdwhit wrote:

Hi Russell,



Just wanted to respond to your question on why the fluid does not need to be cooled - Ans: because there is so much of it, it really does not get as hot as the trannys that have a smaller fluid capacity. I could be wrong, but that's what I have been told, and it seems to make sense (at least to me...).



Michael



PS I still owe you an e-mail and some pictures, and intend to do so soon!

A complete refill 11 quarts, that 5 quarts more than today's automatics and this is used to lube the rear assembly. Walt.

RL Chilton

walt's garage-53 wrote:

A complete refill 11 quarts, that 5 quarts more than today's automatics and this is used to lube the rear assembly. Walt.

Mamma-mia, thatsalotta oil!! Thanks, Walt and Michael. Now why aren't today's transmissions built like they used to?

[Deleted User]

RL Chilton wrote:

Mamma-mia, thatsalotta oil!! Thanks, Walt and Michael. Now why aren't today's transmissions built like they used to?

The cost would make the transmissions today cost in the thousands. A 51 to 60 Hydro can make a complete car today. Walt.

Park_W

Dave, sorry I didn't follow this thread earlier. Consider getting the car or the tranny to "Henny" Jacobs, in Greenville, SC. Not too far away. He has a big tranny shop and is a master on the earlier automatics. Great guy ... multi-make collector, Hudson owner and Dixie Chapter member. e-mail gnvltran@bellsouth.net; phone 864 834-5804.

SuperDave

Park W wrote:

Dave, sorry I didn't follow this thread earlier. Consider getting the car or the tranny to "Henny" Jacobs, in Greenville, SC. Not too far away. He has a big tranny shop and is a master on the earlier automatics. Great guy ... multi-make collector, Hudson owner and Dixie Chapter member. e-mail gnvltran@bellsouth.net; phone 864 834-5804.

Thanks park,

I'll enlist his help,

Dave