UH OH! Is it possible to spin a bearing.....?

jjbubaboy

Was crusing down the road today for a good test drive after getting my 36T engine and trans back in the car. I was probably pushing a little hard, doing about 55 or so, when all of a sudden a very loud high pitched squeel came on. Probably doing about 3000rpm's or so. Sounded like the rear part of the engine or trans. I pushed in the clutch and pulled over right away and it stopped. She idled fine and seemed OK when I proceeded back on the road. I turned her around and proceeded home at a slower pace and it didnt happen again but now I am worried....

Its the 212 splasher 6 engine by the way.

Thanks,

Jeff

Geoff

I had a similar experience with a '50 Pacemaker. It turned out to be a dry speedo cable. It wouldn't be an engine bearing, that would be a knock, not a squeal. It could be a dry generator bearing, or distributor spindle. Get your oil can on to the front and rear bearings of the generator, and into the oil fitting on the distributor shaft. And check for foregin objects that may have fallen into the clutch housing. Just a few suggestions. Good luck

Unknown

Geoff is right of course , could also have been the clutch throw out bearing if your pretty sure the noise came from down under rather than out front . Have you got it adjusted properly so it backs completely off the clutch , pedal return springs up to par , etc . ? BUD

jjbubaboy

Thanks guys!

I will check all the things that Geoff mentioned, although I am fairly sure those are all OK as I just went through just about everything.

I just had the whole clutch done and set up by Ron F and the throwout bearing rebuilt as well. Put in a new pilot bearing as well.

The bearing did seem to be up against the fingers on the pressure plate when I bolted the trans back up but that was how I was when I took it apart as well. Hmmm....

Thanks again and keep the input coming!

Jeff

Richard E.

Might have been your fan belt? If it happened upon aceleration? If it had been an internal engine problem, I doubt that you would have made it home.

ESSX28-1

Did the noise stop as soon as you depressed the clutch or only after you had stopped?

jjbubaboy

Hey Dave,

Since it kinda freaked me out, I cant say if it stopped when I depressed the clutch or when the engine throttled down. It stopped before the car did though.



And Richard, I will check to see if the belt shows signs of slippage. I wasnt really accelerating at the time, just maintaing a steady speed.

Thanks guys!



Jeff

Unknown

Hi Jeff

Sounds like clutch slippage, i had simular noise in my 34 till i changed the oil to dexron atf, just a suggeston



Rob

Jon B

Before you do anything rash, just disconnect the speedo cable from the speedometer and see if it's that! Sounds like it could be that. Try the simplest possibilities first.

terraplane8

Oh dear! I can tell you I heard the same horrible sound in my '36T.



The gearbox had basically fallen apart through extreme wear of bearings, thrust washers etc, necessitating a complete rebuild by Geoff Clark.



The only warning I had was a growly first gear for about three years prior. I should have looked into it sooner.



Hopefully it's something less expensive like a speedo cable.

junkcarfann

Technically speaking, can you "spin a bearing" with a poured bearing? I thought that term was for insert bearings, where the bearing shell welded itself to the crank or other rotating item due to lack of lubrication, and thus became a part of the crank, therefore causing it to spin in its saddle.

jjbubaboy

Hey Junkcarfan,

That was kinda my question too! I didnt know if that was even possible.

And Terraplane 8, I just had Al Saffrahn rebuild my tranny and he did a great job! so I dont think thats the issue.

But why would a speedo cable only do that at high speed after things got real warmed up?

Guess I am leaning toward the clutch/throwout bearing investigation. Those were both recently done and I put in fresh Hudsonite as well!

Thanks gang!

Keep em coming!

Guess I may be 'Hudsonless in Spokane' this year....:eek::mad::mad:

Jeff

[Deleted User]

Technically NO you cannot in the common use SPIN a bearing. However if a part of one of the bearings was to flake off and jam between the crank and the rod or block surface I guess it could be called spinning a bearing. This would generally not be at any certain engine speed, it would be a constant squeal and eventually lock up the engine. If you are certain that the noise came from the rear of the engine I would start by checking the throwout bearing clearance to the clutch fingers.If not the throwout bearing check the pilot bearing.
That being said, keep in mind that I have never worked on a Hudson clutch......Ford Chevy Mopar, yes..... So I may be speaking out of turn.
Bob Hickson

Huddy42

I would first check the inner speedo cable, had this happen to me once when on a rally, made hell of a scream, disconnected the cable and it was fine. Lubed the cable well on return home and never heard a noise since.

Richard E.

It is possible to pull the transmission up into the cab, but it is no picnic. You have to remove the front seat and take out the removeable section of the floor pan, drop the drive shaft and you have to support the engine as the rear engine mount is on the transmission. It helps to have two people to lift it out. The bellhousing and trans come out as one unit. Then you can remove the pressure plate and inspect the clutch, pilot bearing and the throwout bearing. You said that you had put this all in new, so you really shouldn't have a problem there. Have you had the engine apart before?

Jon B

Have you tried simple troubleshooting yet?



1. Start engine and run at different speeds (with car stationary), with clutch both in and out, to try to replicate the squeal.



2. If no squeal, detach speedo cable from back of speedometer and take car for drive to see if squeal perists.



At least, if you do this, you will begin to get some idea of where the trouble lies. Right now, everyone is simply conjecturiing on this and that.

jjbubaboy

Richard E. wrote:

It is possible to pull the transmission up into the cab, but it is no picnic. You have to remove the front seat and take out the removeable section of the floor pan, drop the drive shaft and you have to support the engine as the rear engine mount is on the transmission. It helps to have two people to lift it out. The bellhousing and trans come out as one unit. Then you can remove the pressure plate and inspect the clutch, pilot bearing and the throwout bearing. You said that you had put this all in new, so you really shouldn't have a problem there. Have you had the engine apart before?

Hey Richard,

Nope, the engine was supposed to have a good rebuild on it so I pulled the pan and cleaned and reoiled and put back on with new gaskets.

When the trans is put back to the engine, should the T O bearing be tight up against the P P fingers? Mine is.



And Jon, yes I tried to get it to squeel again but no luck. I will lube the cable and then go drive and see what happens.

Thanks!

Jeff

Unknown

Throw out bearing should not be tight with pedal up. I still bet that is the problem . You need to go thru the linkage adjustments and bring them to the specs in your manual .

Richard E.

If you can't reproduce the sound and it still drives, it can't be too serious! I had a bell housing explode on my '36T after I re-installed the transmission. It was pretty exciting, I was going about 50mph when it happened. Now I know why they made scatter sheilds on old race cars. Luckily for me, everything went down. I had to replace the drive shaft, the front collar of the trans and of course the bell housing. Never did figure out what I had done wrong? But I haven't tried to reproduce the event! LOL!

Jon B

Jeff:



It might not be a problem with the speedo cable. It might be the speedo itself. Try leaving the cable unhooked and see if you still get the noise "at speed". After you're fairly sure that your engine / transmission / clutch / bellhousing / radio isn't going to explode, then re-attach the cable. If you then get the shrieking noise, it's time to send the speedo out to a good shop for fixing.

junkcarfann

Richard E. wrote:

If you can't reproduce the sound and it still drives, it can't be too serious!

With all due respect, that could be very bad advice.



I had a Harley Dresser that made a "funny noise" for a few moments, then the noise stopped.



So I drove it, and about 50 miles later the engine was toast. Turns out one of the roller lifter roller bearings seized up, which was the original noise. It went away as the roller, now not rolling, flattened out and rode the cam, like a conventional tappet, which was totally quiet, that is until what was left of the roller grenaded, and sent little bits of metal throughout the engine.



Moral: bad noises don't fix themselves. They may go away and hide, but unless the problem that caused the noise is fixed, it is not fixed.

[Deleted User]

I have to agree with Junkcarfann, Any squeal should be fully investigated. My buddy and I had a Camaro we drag raced in 1985. We started it up in the garage one Friday night getting ready to go to the track on Saturday. Anyway, it squealed very loudly so I quickly shut it down. We could find nothing wrong so restarted the engine and it sounded fine, Temp was fine, Oil pressure was fine, etc.....everything looked good after about 30 minutes run time, so We changed oil and filter and found no particles or anything in the oil so, buttoned it up and put it on the trailer. Chalked it up to maybe a belt slipping or some thing. Anyways we could not get it to squeal again........ The next day after 2 runs the engine hand grenaded at 8000 rpm in high gear! Man, everything happened so fast that I didn't have time to be scared but after we towed it back to the trailer and checked it out we had a rod sticking through the side of the block and two rods sticking out of the oil pan. Then I was scared.......we saved one head and the intake system everything else was junk!
So check it until you find the problem. It may run for years or it may break the next time you fire it up. Might as well find the problem and save yourself the worries about wether it is ok or not.

Bob

jjbubaboy

Jon B wrote:

Jeff:



It might not be a problem with the speedo cable. It might be the speedo itself. Try leaving the cable unhooked and see if you still get the noise "at speed". After you're fairly sure that your engine / transmission / clutch / bellhousing / radio isn't going to explode, then re-attach the cable. If you then get the shrieking noise, it's time to send the speedo out to a good shop for fixing.

Hey Jon,

Well I pulled it today and cleaned it and lubed it and put it all back together.

Guess we will see if I get any noises or not. Cruised all around town today and no problems so far. Engine ran great, clutch and trans seemed to work wonderful as well. Hmmm....

Thanks,

Jeff

jjbubaboy

Jon B wrote:

Jeff:



It might not be a problem with the speedo cable. It might be the speedo itself. Try leaving the cable unhooked and see if you still get the noise "at speed". After you're fairly sure that your engine / transmission / clutch / bellhousing / radio isn't going to explode, then re-attach the cable. If you then get the shrieking noise, it's time to send the speedo out to a good shop for fixing.

37 Terraplane#2 wrote:

Throw out bearing should not be tight with pedal up. I still bet that is the problem . You need to go thru the linkage adjustments and bring them to the specs in your manual .

Hey 37T,

Thought I had it set up fine and seems to be working great. The way the fork assembly is and how the pedal linkage hooks up, I dont see how to back off any kind of adjustment. It all only fits one way as near as I can tell.

Check and recheck it again....

Thanks,

Jeff