308 oiling modifications

Majumbo

Hello I want to know what you guys have done with any oiling mods. I'm in the process of building my 308 but its just in the parts aquirement stage haha. I'm sure there is a thread already I couldn't find any in the search here. I saw a picture with steel braided lines coming out of the oil pump and I was wondering what they were for. Thank you


Also if any body could give me a link to the cooling system mods by Rudy Bennett with the hose coming off the water pump to the block. I saw the PDF once but I can't find it anymore due to ken cates website being down

GrimGreaser

Put very simply, you can block the passage from the oil pump to the main oil valley and then route from the oil pump straight to a oil filter back to the main oil galley, now you have full flow filtering instead just bypass. Have to do it so the oil isn't restricted in any way though, right tube and fitting size.

Majumbo

Is there a kit that somebody sells or a tech note or something?

GrimGreaser

There's a better description of one of the ways in this thread on the the HAMB: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=539734

Majumbo

Okay what's this? The blue this by the oil pump that the lines are going into? And what about the cooling mod where you drill and tap the water pump and run the lines to the dr side of the block

Majumbo

GrimGreaser

I believe Twin-H has taken multiple lines off the pump output side and plumbed them to a manifold, which then heads to the filter. The reason for multiple lines is to keep the flow area high to keep back pressure to a minimum to keep from starving the oil system.

TwinH

My 308 came to me with the full flow conversion already done. I just redid it for this build.
There just isn't much flow area in a 1/8" npt fitting,and it varies by manufacturer. I added the
third takeoff from the pump (It was already drilled/tapped/plugged) for insurance. This is what it
originally looked like:




Now I have 3 -6(3/8") lines feeding into that blue manifold and -8 (1/2") hoses going to
the filter and back into the block oil galley. The output between the pump and block is tapped
and plugged forcing all oil through the ford oil filter.






The reality is it worked fine in its first configuration,it just didn't inspire much confidence
in my mind with its hodgepodge of fittings. All the bearings were fine when I tore the original
engine down. I t failed because of badly worn ring lands in the old Jahns pistons that had
broke half the top rings and when the second ring failed on #5 it put pressure into the crankcase
and turned into a smoker.

GrimGreaser

I'm thinking of modifying the pump cover with a large fitting, so multiple small fittings aren't needed off of the pump body.

Majumbo

A reasoning to the madness thank you. Beautiful engine!

TwinH

I'm thinking of modifying the pump cover with a large fitting, so multiple small fittings aren't needed off of the pump body.

Ggreaser, I like the way you think. If output is available on the cover end this would be much
simpler. Seems like it would be easy enough to machine a thicker cover to route the output
straight to a -8 fitting in the cover. Oh,and sell copies to bring full-flow filtration to the masses.

TwinH

And Majumbo, it is most definitely a madness. Lol Thanks.

brumac

Ggreaser, I would be first in line for a modified oil pump cover so please machine up two. Bruce

brumac

Majumbo, I have Ken Cates information about cooling in the PDF format. Send me your e-mail address and I will forward the file to you. Bruce hetbrumac2@verizon.net

[Deleted User]

What a wast of time and does not help in any way. The Hudson oil system with my oil filter kit does all the filtering that the motor needs. My engine has 142,000 miles since rebuild, 11 trips across this country, ocean to ocean, all in 12 years. Change oil every 3,000 miles and come out clean just like when installed. My kit is right in the fan air and keeps the oil 10 degrees cooler. That kit in the picture is right in the hottest part of the engine, under the exhaust pipes. Walt

Ol racer

Walt,
When time permits please Post a picture of your System.. Thanks

[Deleted User]

I go into the hospital tomorrow morning, 6am, so am cleaning up all my old mail as I will not be on again until I get my I-PAD in about 1 week. Here is the picture of my set up and it filters all oil that gets by the by pass check valve because I use 5/16 hose, special, and a modern oil filter, Fram PH8A used on all Ford products. If you install it on a old engine, it will take some time to clean the old slug out, If pan is dropped and cleaned, oil will stay that way. I need your e-mail address to enclose the picture. Can't do it here. Send me the address but add het in front to fool the computer that sends spam. Walt.

Majumbo

Well not to bash your opinion and I'm not trying to offend you Walt, but back then all they had was non detergent oil so they didn't want the sludge flowing around the engine to clog an oil passage, especially with splasher engines, the argument of putting detergent oil today in a non rebuilt motor is valid because of the filter only filtering the small percent. Hence like you having a rebuilt motor being clean on the inside, I'm assuming you run detergent oil, the original setup works because there is a marginal area of sludge buildup because of basic maintenance and the rebuild. And the detergent oil. Now if you flip the script, all cars today have a full flow type oil filter. So if, like I am, going to rebuild my engine, running a full flow system with detergent oil doesn't seem that much of a waste of time because it would mean better protection for my engine and also be modernizing old technology. Do I make sense? This is just my opinion. I'm open to any body else's thoughts on this subject. Please I'd like to hear

Lee ODell

A few years ago I was wondering if non detergent oil still existed. When I finely found some for sale, which wasn't easy, the label clearly stated not to use in gas powered engines. I think 1960 was the last time I used non detergent oil after seeing the inside of an engine that used detergent oil and not a sign of sludge build up. The detergent oil did not create a sludge oiling problem in my old cars even back then. Nor has it up till now. Perhaps I was lucky, however in my case, it has done a better job keeping my engines cleaner inside. Then came multi grade detergents with additionl benefits. I guess that could be a new topic.

The worst case of sludge I have seen was my Dad's 59 Pontiac he bought new. He proudly used Pensoil until I showed him the mess. In 1961 I removed the valve covers to install new gaskets. The sludge was so thick the whole inside of the valve cover area was full of sludge. He switch to another oil company.

Many years ago or probably decades ago I read an article relating to the concern of detergent oil used in older cars with sludge build up. The test result was that the detergent oil did not dilute the sludge into a floating liquified mess.

Having cut open many aircraft and automotive oil filters to check what is collected, I have found, under normal conditions, the most debris collected in the oil filter has always been right after a new or rebuilt engine starts up and runs through first 1/2 hour, no matter how carefully the parts are kept clean while assembling engine. Try that some time after rebuild. You will be surprised what you find inside your filter. Even though you were so very very careful keeping part clean. Never have I see an older cars oil filter clogged by using detergent oil with regular oil changes, But I have seen many engines ruined by neglecting oil changes. That is when sludge accumulates to the extent oil passages close up. Driving long distances non stop will do wonders to minimize sludge buildup. Short distances creates sludge faster. Long storeage time allow sludge to thicken, settle and stick to oil passages. A car not driven is the cars worst enemy.

A few experiences,
Lee O'Dell

Geoff

I concur wholeheartedly Lee. Almost exactly parallels my own experience.
Geoff