FAKE HUDSON parts and service sign on Ebay

[Deleted User]

Ebay # 310655035550 is another artificially aged. NEW Fantasy sign an unscrupulous seller is trying to unload..

hudsontech

Back looks like some sort of reddish paint. If you enlarge the pictures it looks like the "rust" effect was spread with a cloth.

Hudsonly,
Alex Burr
Memphis, TN

Jon B

What put you onto the fact that this was fake? Was it that Hudson never made a sign this size? Or is the design non-original?

amc360

I think the rust on the back may look that way because someone may have tried to clean it or grind it off and just wipe the rust around. I also think if someone was going to all the trouble to make a fake it would not be for a Hudson it would be for one of the more popular makes. I would think it is real

StillOutThere

So you guys are saying there is such a large collector market for stepdown era Hudson dealership signs that someone has gone to the trouble and expense to reproduce them? I'd think not. This is much more likely the inexpensive single sided sign that was offered to the dealers rather than the double sided porcelain to be suspended off the side of a building.

[Deleted User]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hudson-Parts-Service-Vintage-Sign-Repro-WALL-GRAPHIC-FAT-DECAL-MAN-CAVE-MURAL-/261031693895?pt=Apparel_Merchandise&var=&hash=item3cc6b38e47&vxp=mtr
Above is a Hudson repo sign from Ebay , one of many repo's of Hudson dealer signs from all eras.
So yes there is a market for them I'd think or these folks wouldn't waste their time,
Roger

hoggyrubber

i bought one about this size on ebay a while back. if it was a fake it was a definate old fake. it was single sided just like this but it was porcelain on both. the mounting holes on it had small brass rings that had slightly elongated over time and it had a couple of nail holes and some very old rust. the guy i got it from knew the dealership it came from. i can post up a picture of mine if you guys would like to see it.

[Deleted User]

I too am a little bit suspicisous that this sign may not be an original. For one, I have a reproduction metal baked enamel Hudson sign just like this with the same measurements (paid around $65.00 for it a few years ago). Two, the point at the sign's bottom is not bent at all which is often the case with an original. Also, I believe the original dealer signs had a porcelain enamel finish and this one doesn't seem to have one.

This is not to say I'm 100% positive on this not being an original. It could be one that indeed survived in really good shape over the years and did have just a regular painted finish. But, I have my doubts as stated above (as well as what a few others have pointed out) and I wouldn't get too crazy bidding on this sign.

Dan

Jon B

So....now some people are thinking that this sign is for real, eh?

I guess the reason I would doubt it: in what universe would a dealer hang out a sign that measured 29" x 19"? (For anyone who saw the movie, "This is Spinal Tap", think: Stonehenge.)

[Deleted User]

I have a catalog titled "Approved Hudson Dealer Signs" which is from either 1953 or '54 (has Jet signs illustrated). The sign advertised in this catalog that's similar to the one in question on eBay measures 30" high x 42" wide. The catalog describes it as: "constructed of a single sheet of heavy gauge steel, finished on both sides in three-color vitreous porcelain enamel".

There is also the same Hudson sign shown in this catalog that's a larger highway version that's 6 feet wide and 4 feet high. It's described as: "all-steel construction, including the sign panels, which are weatherproof and finished with nonfading enamel." Apparently, the highway version didn't have a porcelain enamel finish.

No where in this catalog is a sign available that's 29" wide. Hope this information helps those of you considering bidding on the sign presently available for sale on eBay.

Dan

hudsontech

Dan, a catalog of dealer signs needs to be scanned an place in the online library - as long as it can be laid flat for scanning.

Hudsonly,
Alex Burr
Memphis, TN

Jon B

Actually, I have one of the 6 x 4 enamel highway signs. I salvaged it from a field near Rushville, Indiana in 1967 or 68. The farmer's wife gave it to me. She said that she hadn't received any rent on the sign from the local Hudson dealer for years!

I cannot fathom where a dealer might display a sign that was only 29" wide. Certainly not outside, where you'd need binoculars to read it. Maybe inside, at the parts counter? But then, if an interior sign, why porcelain enamel?

[Deleted User]

Alex, I'm afraid that scanning the Hudson sign catalog would affect the spine. I could, however, take closeup digital photos. By the way, I have several old Hudson sign order forms. The original non-illuminated 42" Hudson "Parts Service" or "Sales Service" sign sold for $28.00. And the neon "sales service" clock sold for $33.74. The form has a date of 12-53.

Dan

[Deleted User]

Fake advertising signs of ALL sizes have been around for years. I have no problem with that, but when they are beat up and rusted just to fool the buyers, it kind of hacks me off. This is becoming a HUGE problem in the " Petrobilia" field.
Hudson never issued a sign like the one on Ebay

faustmb

That original link sure looks phony to me. There is still an original porcelain sign hanging on my dads garage and it looks 50 times better than that one after 60 years in the weather. Someone tried very hard for the "distressed look" . I have never seen a sign from that vintage with that look..

My 0.02

Hudsonrules

Another scammer, makes the hobby look bad.

bob ward

I have no idea whether the sign under discussion is genuine or not. It can be very hard to tell from photos if anything is the real McCoy, only personal inspection will reveal the truth.

In favour of the seller is his 100% positive feedback on 300+ sign sales. If anyone on here buys it please let us know what you think when you get it.

Nevada Hudson

Hudson's Grill, after they went bankrupt in most areas, were selling their signs. They were hand painted and hand cut. One of the former owners was trying to sell me one of these signs for top $, and I told him they were way over priced fakes. He said that he would take them to the Portland Swap meet and get his price there.

[Deleted User]

I see the Hudson Parts-Service sign being discussed here has sold for a "buy it now" amount of $350.00.

[Deleted User]

And the buyer could have got one from the same batch, not beat up, for $69. Total fraud

Jon B

This raises an interesting speculation.

Let's assume for the moment that the sign was merely a reproduction that had been "aged". The buyer, not knowing better, bought it for $350. This will cause people to create more ''distressed" reproduction signs.

Apparently even a bunch of experts like us, disagree whether this was sign was 'real' or not. The evidence is skimpy. (Just because they're not shown in a Hudson catalog for dealer's accessories, doesn't mean they never existed.) Certainly, the buyers of these questionable signs won't want to admit they've been scammed, so will proudly proclaim theirs to be real collectors items. As the signs are re-sold, new buyers will pay ever-higher prices, creating their own constituency for ''the new reality''. And as time passes the evidence (or lack of it) will become lost in the mists of time, further blurring the line between reality and fantasy. Eventually the growing number of these knock-offs will take on their own reality -- flood the market, so to speak. They'll take the place of signs that never existed in the first place. And it won't matter anymore if they were authentic or bogus.

Of course, on the other hand, that Ebay sign COULD be authentic. LOL!

hoggyrubber

i hope i'm not too late to get some info on my sign. i bought it as an original, but who knows. i was told it was removed from a door on a hudson dealership near the heinz factory in ohio. what do you guys think? is it a fake like on of the repro's mentioned above? i'm curious now!

ski4life65

yours looks like porcelain.......not painted like the Ebay "fake"

[Deleted User]

Yes you can see the chipped pocelain ,and it has the rings in the hanger holes ,they didn't use them but they are there,
Roger

hoggyrubber

yes, it's def porcelain. i guess it could have been made by another company and not listed in the hudson catalog. it has no makers mark or anything and the rust looks "official" or "gauranteed old" as a auctioneer once liked to say. i paid about $200 a while back. if it's a fake it's still a pretty neat sign. but i would like to know if it's a true hudson sign.

Jon B

What is the size?

[Deleted User]

Hoggyrubber, I believe your Hudson sign is a reproduction seeing that it measures across around 17". One of these seems to be presently up for sale on eBay under the title "Large Hudson Sales Service Porcelain Enameled Steel Sign." It has a starting bid of $15.00. I also have this sign in my own collection which I'm pretty sure our Chicago-Milwaukee Hudson chapter sold as a fund raising project around 15 to 20 years ago. These signs also come up for sale from time to time at regional and national Hudson meets as I've seen them for sale there as late as last year.

Lastly, your sign may actually have been attached to a Hudson dealer. However, it may have been a former Hudson dealer and someone just put the sign there for a number of years and it was weathered as a result. Hope I'm wrong here and someone else proves your sign to be at least 60 years old.

Dan

PAULARGETYPE

I'M NOT SAYING WHAT IT IS BUT IF IT'S A HUDSON SIGN AND YOU HAVE IT PUT IT UP ON YOUR BUILDING SMILE BECAUSE ALOT OF PEOPLE DON'T HAVE A SIGN

hudsontech

1949superg worte: "I'm afraid that scanning the Hudson sign catalog would affect the spine."
I was afraid of that Dan - but thanks for the offer to try and digtally photograph it. I think we'll just let it go for now. Maybe some day one will come along that can be scanned.

Hudsonly,
Alex Burr
Memphis, TN

hoggyrubber

i do have the sign up in my garage now, and i do enjoy it. i'm not upset if it isn't a original dealer sign. however i would like to know the truth as not to pass on any more misinformation in the future. i am thinking that 1049superg is correct about it prob being a repro. like i said that's ok. i would rather it be orig, but it is what it is.
Jon b the lenth is about 17" or 18" i had a tape measure across the top. thanks again for all the info everyone. stacy k

Jon B

Thanks, Stacy. As to its authenticity as a dealer sign, I am no expert. Eighteen inches seems a bit small for anything that's to hang on the side of a building.

But one thing we can all agree on: it would be a great decoration on any garage or "man cave" wall!