Need advice on removing some parts.

raidmagic

Hey guys. I need to remove my front seat and transmission. I haven't dug into it yet I just want go into it with my eyes open. It's a 49 with a 308 and 3 speed manual with overdrive. I have been under the car and I see the cross member isn't removable so I'm figuring something else needs to happen here. Maybe a section of the floor is removable?
Anyway anything you can offer for help would be great. Thanks

lostmind

It is best to remove the complete seat assembly. You have to adjust it to access the bolts,
after you remove the bottom cushion. Once you remove the floor mat , or carpet , it will be pretty obvious which bolts need to removed to get the floor section out.
If it's not overdrive , it's pretty simple , OD limits your travel room to remove the trans.
Best to use a floor jack to support it. You may want to remove the Solenoid for frame clearance.
Probably a good idea to put a tarp on the floor , remove the trans from the top side , through to car.

[Deleted User]

Forgot where the link is, but find the shop service manual for the step downs. It does a great job of describing the process with decent pictures.
The tranny will be accessed through the inside of the car after you remove a section of floor. This section is in the center firewall and runs to the front seat. The seat and climate control blower must be removed along with a few various wires. A dozen or so cap screws hold the floor in, and they are sometimes buried under the tar that seals the removable section to the main floor.

That's the general method to get at the tranny, and the rest is clutch, gear shift, driveshaft, exhaust, starter bolts, mount bolts, bell housing bolts and etc.

Just curious, are you upgrading or repairing?

[Deleted User]

plenty of room, even if it has overdrive.

raidmagic

Fantastic! Thanks, I am repairing. I have quite the "roar" in 1st, 2nd and reverse. Quiet as a mouse in 3rd. I've been told it's the bearings that the shaft rides on so I figured I'd pull it out and see if I can repair it. Will I be unbolting it from the bell housing or the bell housing and all from the motor.

[Deleted User]

No way to separate from bell housing in the car. The bell housing on the single lever units is basicly the front of the transmission. Also you can pull the motor and transmission as a unit if you don't want to mess with the floor panel,
Roger

Park_W

It does indeed sound like the front mainshaft bearing is shot. You might want to consider the merit of taking the tranny and bell housing out the bottom. It's quite a bit less back-breaking than lifting out the top. But the advantage really comes when it's time to reinstall it. Much easier to support it and get it lined up if done from the bottom. This requires removing some of the parking brake linkage, but no big thing to do that. It's pretty obvious what needs to come out. Doing it from the bottom does require the car to be up higher off the floor, because of the height of the bell housing.

[Deleted User]

http://www.classiccar.com/forum/discussion/163008/free-single-lever-transmissions-parts#Item_1

I suppose I could send you some parts if you really need them.

most bearings are still readily available though, but you will need a hydraulic press.
usually cheaper if you go to a bearing supply than an auto parts store.

RonS

Wow! that is a lot of work to remove the manual trans. Removal of the seat assembly to gain access? in addition, rust repair in the floor panels makes floor removal even more of a challenge. I have a Hydromatic . I thought that the cross member can be removed with a trans jack set in place to gain clearance for removal. Am I incorrect? I'm not familiar with the manual, but, could the crossmember be cut in the same manner as Hyrdos, then bolted back in place? I did that on a Samco Cord with a C4 automatic. How do you avoid banging the trans into your nicely restored interior with top removal?

Park_W

The crossmember is indeed removable on the Hydramatic cars, but you still have to pull the floor pan to get at the upper bell housing bolts. On the stick-shift cars, the tranny's not all that hard to remove with the crossmember in place. Not worth sawing up the car to make it easier.

Park_W

Absolutely right, Doc. An old scissors jack with a 2x4 on top of it, supporting across the rear of the oil pan, works fine.

RonS

Aren't there access holes to the upper fly wheel housing bolts under the carpet beneath the heater. That would require only heater box removal and rolling back the carpet, no?

[Deleted User]

I removed my manual through the top. I recall it being tight to do that, and it didn't seem any better dropping it down and out. I strongly suggest removing the panel, as it opens up everything to a manageable level and there is always cleaning to do. I can't imagine doing it with the panel in place, but then again I was working on a center post lift that was equally obtrusive as anything on the car itself.

Its not a bad job, just take your time. Looking again at the photo, exhaust stayed, but brake pedal shaft had to be removed to get the panel off and the crank case breather pipe was fastened to bell housing. I also don't recall if the center member was welded to the frame. Good luck. Sounds like its warranted.

SuperDave

The 51 and later cars had two access holes in the center floor cover to reach the top bell housing bolts. Prior to that, the entire cover had to be removed. The 51 and later cover is shaped a little differently to give more room for the huge Hydramatic. The covers are interchangeable with the exception of the bolt holes in the firewall. they are in different places. I have no clue why??? all the floor bolts line up OK. I just used a 51 cover on a 49 and had to reposition those firewall bolts. Removing a single lever transmission with OD without removing the center floor cover is something I wouldn't even think about. Been there ..done that ... several times in the last 40 years. Seems like every Hudson I have had needed clutch work. I have a zipper on my 49 Convertible!

RonS

Ah yes,I only assumed that all stepdowns had those access holes for the bolts. Those holes would be there when the job was done on a car that I owned. Thanks Dave, thought I was loosing my mind.

raidmagic

Thanks for the advice guys. It is a dual lever transmission, I've seen a few posts referring to a single lever, if it matters. I'll be pulling it out the bottom only because I have a lift and a transmission jack. I see now how the floor being removed would make all the difference. I was under the car looking at it and couldn't imagine how to get the trans back with the floor in the way. I'll be starting tonight so I'll post on my progress as I go.

[Deleted User]

It makes all the difference if its a two lever you can remove it and leave the bell housing in. Cant do that on older one,
Roger

raidmagic

It appeared that I could separate them. I have the seat, floor, driveshaft and all wiring removed. Tomorrow I'm going with a buddy to check out a 57 Chevy wagon so I might not get any time for it but I have to unbolt the trans and it appears some of the mess that is the e brake set up and it will come right out. I'll keep you all updated.

raidmagic

OK it's out. Now some more questions.

What does this transmission decode to. The date under the numbers is 1/16/53. I'd assume that's the assembly date.


What is the push button thing that goes under the gas pedal?

What is this wiring that goes across the rear of the transmission? I damaged the plug a little but it's fixable.
I've included pictures of these items if you need to see anything else let me know. Thanks guys.

[Deleted User]

Any chance you have a drive master setup? I haven't had any experience with mine other than plugging it back in. I have super magic drive and switches are same. I'm guessing that's what they are for.

Did you end up dropping the cross member and tranny down?

raidmagic

I don't know what a drive master set up is....
No you can't remove the crossmember it's part of the frame. I unbolted the trans from the bellhousing and dropped it out the bottom

[Deleted User]

Switch under accelerator is the kick down switch for OD units (equivalent of passing gear for automatic). Not sure about other plug. OD solenoid?

raidmagic

OK well the OD doesn't work. I haven't played with it because I knew I had to remove the trans anyway. I'll sort all that out after I get this problem handled

[Deleted User]

looks like the other one is a control switch to keep OD from kicking in at the wrong time. Yup, one problem at a time. Keep us updated.

lostmind

I believe the small square switch is your reverse lock out switch , so you can back up without taking the car out of overdrive. It's the one by the broken wire.
I'm going by memory , maybe someone else can verify this.

raidmagic

Does anyone have a break down on the internals of the transmission? I have a book but it doesn't go that in depth. Also where would be a good place to get a service manual on these cars? Thanks

[Deleted User]

How many do you want ? Sounds like you want the service manual as well as a parts book .. I have more than I need if you want I'll sell you what you need,
Roger

raidmagic

Tallent R I'll give you the name of what I have when I get home and if you have stuff that will complement that I'd be interested.


Doc, I'm a member I will go look around there as well, thanks

[Deleted User]

The club store does have a lot of the books . Keepin mmind there is a body book and a mechanical manual. As well as parts books
Roger