Seat belts? Side mirrors? Safety over originality?

SkyDad

Hi, Everyone:

As I work through my 1957 Hornet Super restoration, I am seriously considering adding seat belts and side mirrors. I have a young daughter and would love to take her cruising with me on road trips, but want to be sure it's as safe as I can make it without taking too much originality away. Curious as to everyone's thoughts on the subject, and if I do add side mirrors that were not standard, what would be the right mirrors? Perhaps a Hollywood mirror from a 56 or other Kenoshas? Seat belts have so many options when adding. Shoulder belts might be challenging and does a lap belt potentially add other dangers if in an accident? Looking for healthy discussion and what some of you may have done when posed with these same decisions. Thanks much in advance! Mike

SkyDad

Thanks Doc! Appreciate the response.

SkyDad

...and I never knew about the clip on mirrors so that is a very cool option for me to look into. Many thanks.

farmermike

This is a very good subject to address. My 35 Terraplane doesn't have turn signals, side mirrors,  and seat belts. I have been taking my grandkids to get ice cream in what they call, grandpa's old, old, old, old, old car. Yes, they say it five times. I have been kind of nervous about having them in the back seat with no seat belts, etc.

For the front seats, would you recommend just lap seatbelts or in these old cars is it safer to just be able to get out of the thing if there is an accident?

As far as turn signals, I think most people think I am just waving at them when I am using hand signals. But I want to keep my car as close to factory original as possible.

Thank you SkyDad for bringing this up. I look forward to hearing what folks think on this subject.

Thanks,

farmermike

cpr3333

My father put seatbelts in his (my) Hudson some time in the late 50's.  When he first met my mother and told her to put on her seatbelt, she didn't know what he was talking about and then wondered if he was a race driver or something.

I'm not sure if the same ones are going to get installed or newer ones, but they will definitely be there before I drive it anywhere.

RL Chilton

Do it!  Agree 100% with DocHubler.  

Browniepetersen

Spent my career as a Safety Professional and I for one am for adding anything that improves the safety of the vehicle. I sometimes do some stupid things (Drove my 52 on the salt flats at 122.683mph. drove my 28 roadster pick up at 90mph) But, the first thing that I do is add seat belts and I am big on directional signals. I also added additional tail lights/brake lights on my English built 36 Hudson. I am long past judging, and in most cases I take advice for what it is (someone's opinion).but, I have never been to any car show worth going to that the judges discounted points because of safety improvements that are realisticly and tastefully done.

I consider it the right thing to do.

Kevin_Ch

I second what DocHubler said. 
Safety first....safety last....and safety all the time in between!
The safety of your daughter, and yourself, is of the utmost importance.  Any Hudsonite worth his salt would never consider criticizing someone for placing safety above originality.

Kevin C

Nevada Hudson

The '57 Hudsons had lap seat belts as an option. I have them on mine and they work fine. Paul Schuster sells the original type mirrors, which you can mount on both sides. They really help visual ability. The '55-57 Hudsons have a large wrap around rear window, and you can see the rear fenders especially well on the '57's with the raised fins.

Nevada Hudson

You can find the original type lap seat belts on the internet or on Hemming's.

12BoltTom

The boy and I are working on a 41 BigBoy and are adding some key safety features to it.
1. Seatbelts, the 3 point type, for them to work in this old truck. The cab is like a tin can. We are adding a mini roll bar to bolt the seatbelts to.
2. Modern brake lights and turn signals
3. Disc brakes on front and improved rear brakes
4. A strong seat that is very secure.

SkyDad

Great discussion, and thanks for all the advice gentlemen. I will certainly touch base with Paul when I reach that point in the restoration. At minimum, I will be installing the lap belts, and thank you NH for helping me realize it was an option in 57. Enjoy the week everyone!

Geoff

Lap belts can sometimes do more harm than no belts, as they allow the head to strike the metal dash, and can cause abdominal injuries. I would recommend proper diagonal shoulder/lap type as you have a steel door post. Indicators can be easily adapted into the existing park and tail lamps by using dual filament bulbs or relays. If you have the original headlamps you will have to fit auxiliary front lamps, but suitably discreet ones can be obtained from places like Restoration Supplies. I consider indicators absolutely necessary for driving in today's traffic, particularly at night.
Geoff

Lee ODell

If you are serious about your daughters safety go with 12BoltTom and Geoff C. N.Z. suggestion by installing 3 point type seat belts. My son, wife and myself were in a rollover accident wearing 3 point seat belts with no injuries. Our torsos were held firmly against the seat. If we were only wearing lap belts we may have ended up with serious head, abdominal and spin injuries or not coming home.

I don't think you would try to save a few dollars by installing only 3 pistons in your 308. With the same reason I don't think you should only install half a seat restraint system. I would suggest installing 3 point seat restraints on both front and back seats.

If a serious accident happened what safety seat belt feature would you wish you had installed?

I have already started installing the same features Tom and Geoff have suggested into my 47 PU. Especially the need for a secure seat in the PU which my original is not. I shudder to think what would happen should the 3 point system hold, and the loose seat trying to squeeze me like a vice between seat and belts as centrifugal force throws it forward.

Thanks Tom for reminding me about secure seat.

Lee O'Dell

AdamB

Mike,

Do a search for "peep mirrors" on ebay and you'll see a lot of options for inexpensive clip-on type mirrors.  Most come with a little felt or rubber pad to put in place to help protect the mounting area, and most use two small allen head screws to lock them down.

As for belts, I'm in agreement with everyone else.  On my '28, I had a lap belt put in the center of the back seat to hold a car seat.  My son's only one right now, but the seat works to 120 lbs, so it will last him a very long time and keep him as safe as can be.  Of course these are also mounted to the frame, not the wood floors.

I also had two lap belts installed up front for us, but it's not ideal.  I also had the thought Lee did, and that was what I wished I had if something did happen.  I opted for some restraint over no restraint, but both have their pluses and minuses.

Adam

RL Chilton

"I also had two lap belts installed up front for us, but it's not ideal.  I also had the thought Lee did, and that was what I wished I had if something did happen.  I opted for some restraint over no restraint, but both have their pluses and minuses."

That's really what it comes down to.  It depends on the TYPE of accident and whether or not lap belts are a plus or minus.  

Jon B

A couple observations:

1.  Didn't Hudson offer outside mirrors in '57?  Seems like they had factory outside mirrors (at least as an option) from the 1930's on...


2.  People keep mentioning turn signals.  I don't think SkyDad was considering adding them, was he?  They would almost certainly have been "standard" by 1957, I would think.

Nevada Hudson

Jon, his could have been removed over the years. Turn signals standard.

Ol racer

FYI

Modern Belts with a shoulder Harness would be best but fabricating the upper connection would mar the  upholstry somewhat....

I would install lap Belts thru the floor into a crossmember and/or frame offering some protection rather than none...

Ive seen Retractors available to wind Lap belts back so they dont dangle across the seat.  Suggest look E Bay ... They have NOS Certified Retractor Lap Belts in different Colors as low as $29.....

Club Coupe

I installed 3 point belts in my coupe when it was restored 10 years ago and have not regretted it.  Mine came fron www.julianos.com

Hudson Grandpa

Hmmm: I am sure that the 57 Hornet did not come with mirrors. I think my dealer installed them when I purchased the car and received it. No belts for sure, but great reclining seats, and not for just sleeping!!!

ken1962

G'day, Here in Australia it is a compulsorily requirement to wear set belts since 1971. My 36T has 3 point sets for the back seat for kids. I'm about to fit some belts on the front seat,(only bought it last year) but the strange thing is that here if the car is registered as "Historic", the safety only needs to match the year of manufacture - so mine only needs to be as safe as a car would be in 1936. 

Currently the Victorian law is:

Children under 6 months of age must:

• Use a rearward facing restraint that is properly fitted to the vehicle and adjusted to fit the child’s body correctly.
• Not travel in the front seat of a vehicle that has a back row or rows of seats.

Children 6 months to 4 years of age must:

• Use either a rearward facing restraint OR a forward facing child restraint with an inbuilt harness, that is properly fitted to the vehicle and adjusted to fit the child’s body correctly
• Not travel in the front seat of a vehicle that has a back row or rows of seats.

Children 4 to 7 years of age must:

• Use either a forward facing child restraint with inbuilt harness OR a booster seat with a properly fasted and adjusted seatbelt.
• Not travel in the front seat of a vehicle that has a back row or rows of seats unless all the other back seats are occupied by children who are also under 7 years of age.

Children over 7 years of age must:

• Use either a booster seat with a properly fastened and adjusted adult seatbelt OR an adult seat with an adult seatbelt.