Power Brake issue

54Hollywood

Calling all you BendixTreadle-Vac fans, I could use some help.  A while back, one of the front brake hoses blew on our '54 Hornet.  So, I replaced both hoses and bled the brakes but now I've got a hard pedal with no braking power.  I thought that might be caused by a vacuum issue so I cleaned the vacuum check valve and replaced the vacuum hose from the power brake unit to the intake manifold (the car doesn't have the reserve vacuum tank).  Still have the same problem.  So my question is, before I pull the power brake unit, what else can I check and do you think I have a vacuum issue or hydraulic issue?  Can I measure the vacuum at the unit and if so, what should it be?  As always, any suggestions are greatly appreciated, thanks.

Tim in WI.   

onerare39

Tim,

I have addressed this same issue several times on this forum.  If you have the original rubber hose that goes from the power brake unit to the distribution block on the frame, that old rubber hose really needs to be replaced or you will probably experience a hard pedal and no brakes at some point in time...  BTDT!!!    I had a new one made by Tompkins.  See the link below.  

 http://www.tompkinsind.com

If you are not able to find a Tompkins in your area I can have one made here at their location in Olathe, Kansas and mail it to you.

John Forkner

54Hollywood

Hi John,

Sounds like you believe it's a hydraulic problem.  Replacing that hose makes a lot of sense.  I'll let you know if I can't find one locally.  Thanks for the suggestion.

Tim in WI.

onerare39

Tim,

It could be something else but I had experienced a hard pedal in my 54 years ago.  I sent my Treadle-Vac to Karps Power Brake in California to resolve the issue.  After installing my rebuilt unit back in the car I still had a hard pedal.  I removed the rubber hose we are speaking of and found that I couldn't even get air through the hose.  The rubber had swollen and deteriorated badly right where the fittings are crimped on.  I ran a small drill through each end and that opened the hose back up, don't do that as a permanent fix!

I searched high and low for a pre-made replacement hose, there were none to be found.  I was lucky enough to have a Tompkins about 30 minutes away from me.  They made a new hose up while I waited.

I think I still have my old original hose that I can take in to have a new one made for you.  Let me know if I can be of help.

John Forkner 

54Hollywood

Hello John,

Well I've about given up trying to find this hose myself.  I've called the usual suspects; Dave Kostansek, Dale Cooper, Jason Fisher at Vintage Coach, Doug Wildrick, Kanter Auto Products and I've been to a couple of local parts stores but no one can come up with either the hose assembly or correct fittings.  I'm very surprised because a number of manufacturers used the Bendix 223 system.  So, I could use your help with this.  I don't want you to have to make the drive out to Tompkins but if you have the old invoice so I could get the part numbers for the fittings and hose assembly, I can give them a call and make some progress with this.  Thanks very much.

Tim in WI.  

onerare39

Tim,

I came to the same conclusion in 2009, none are to be found.

I don't have the invoice, but i don't think that it would have had specific information regarding the hose and fittings, just the cost.  I simply handed them the hose and they made one up, the same as original.  I do have two old hoses, one is smooth the other is ribbed.  The one that I had made was smooth.

I don't have a problem going to Tompkins and having one made for you.  I will ask them how others might go about ordering this particular hose from around the country.  Maybe they can put the nomenclature in their system and assign it a part number, I'll ask.  I'm sure that others would appreciate that.

I can't remember what it cost in 2009 and don't even want to guess now.  Do you want me to get a price quote first or just get one made up for you?

John Forkner

54Hollywood

John,

If it's possible to give them a call to get a quote before running out there, that would be great.  The hose I have is ribbed but I'm sure a smooth one works just as well.  Yes, If they could add that part to their system I'm sure there would be other Hudnuts who would appreciate it!  When you had yours made, did you have any discussion with them about going to a flexible steel line?  Just curious.  Keep in touch and thanks again.

Tim in WI.  

PAULARGETYPE

I ALWAYS DEAL WITH ED STRAIN  FROM FL. FOR THE POWER MASTER CYL'S TREDLE VAC IS WHAT THEY ARE HE IS THE BEST AND THE CHEAPEST $250 FOR A COMPLET REBUILD AND IT LOOKS AND WORKS LIKE NEW 

54Hollywood

John,

One other thing.  I assume that all '54s with Power Brakes use the same hydraulic hose but just to make sure we're both on the same page, here are a couple of pictures of the hose and fitting from our car.  The whole thing measures 16 1/2" from end to end.  Thanks again for your help.

Tim in WI.

Chris Smith

Any hydraulic hose retailer like hose man can make the hose. I would guess 30 bucks

onerare39

Tim,

I needed to go into town this afternoon so I stopped by Tompkins.  I had one made from one of my old ones, here's what I came up with.

Length 16.75, ribbed hose, correct ends with the exception of no hex ends on fittings. $30.94 plus tax and shipping.

If you want they can make one up with flexible steel lines for about $10.00 more.

You can call them directly and order over the phone with the information on the invoice.  Here's the breakdown on the codes; BQ101 is the ribbed rubber hose, HF16, HF16 are the two end fittings, 16.75 is the length.

If you want to buy the one I had made you are welcome to do so, but you are not obligated.

Hope this helps.

John Forkner

54Hollywood

John,

If you really don't need to keep the new one you just had made as a spare, I would be happy to purchase it from you.  Send me a PM and we can go over the details.  I'm assuming it's just like the last one you had them make and that it's the correct fit for the car.  Thanks.

Paul,

Thanks for the tip about Ed Strain and his Treadle-Vac rebuilding services.  I will keep that in mind if I need to have that done.

Tim in WI.