hornet

fabit
fabit Member
in HUDSON
Hi, I have started work on a Hudson that I have had for some time. I am unsure of the year and the more I research the serial number the more I am confused. The serial # is 49441971 which I guess states its a 49 hornet?? Read online they only made 18 hornets in 49 is it possible this is one of the 18?   Thanks in advance for any help

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  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor
    fabit

    The first year Hornet was 1951. From your SN it is either a 1949 Sedan, Club Coupe or Convertible Brugham
    What model do you have?

    Lee O'Dell
  • fabit
    fabit Member

    ?

  • fabit
    fabit Member

    Sorry my comments didn't post. I think its a hornet all emblems and interior parts state that it is. Car is unmolested been in a shop on lift since 1979!!. My projects take a while but that's a while to tie lift up!! So I don't want to alter or modify a rare car???  Thanks Bill

  • RL Chilton
    RL Chilton Administrator, Member
    As Lee pointed out, 494 denotes 1949 model year.  Hornets were introduced in the 1951 model year.  Every piece of trim on your car denotes 1953 Hornet.  

    So, either all of the trim, front end, rockers have been changed on your car, or the VIN tag has been changed.  Interior pictures of your car would help, but the proof is in the pudding.  The SN (or VIN) is also stamped on top of the passenger side wheelbarrow portion of the frame (in front of the cowl) in a couple places.  Usually have to remove tranny hump floor pan (made to be removeable) to find out for sure.  

    Anyone that told you only 18 Hornets were made in 1949 was selling something.  It's not true.  
  • fabit
    fabit Member
    Ok I will grab some interior pics and post after work . It has the dual carbs and manual tranny if that helps. I will also ck for number on frame. I had read the statement about the 18 hornets while researching the vin on line unsure where but thanks for help hope to figure out soon.
  • JasonNC
    JasonNC Expert Adviser
    What Russell said.....
  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor
    Bill
    The SN says 1949. The Hood is 1953, grill and front turn signals 1951, tail lights 49, side trim 52 or 53.
    You have someones attempt to make a 49 look like a Hornet. The engine number should match the SN. It is stamped on flat vertical location on the front side of the engine just below the cylinder head and forward of exhaust manifold. Someones attempt to make a 49 look like a Hornet.
    Lee O'Dell
  • fabit
    fabit Member
    Ok Thanks I will try and come up with some numbers. Thanks for help
  • JasonNC
    JasonNC Expert Adviser
    What Lee said....
  • RL Chilton
    RL Chilton Administrator, Member
    Yes, that's true about the taillights and front parking lamps, didn't even look that close.  
  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor

    Bill

    I apologies if I came across criticizing your car. I don't mean to. From what I see from the pictures, you have a good looking car. Get it running, new tires and enjoy. Maybe what you have is a customized 1949 Hudson Commodore Eight Sedan now powered by a powerful 308 Twin-H Hornet engine. Nothing wrong with that.

    Here is some additional information from Alex Burr's General Information Handbook for Hudson Built Automobiles, SN beginning with 494 is a 1949 Commodore Eight sedan. It originally came with a 254 straight 8 cylinder engine.

    Also, you may be lucky and someone installed a 308 Twin-H engine too.

    The SN on your engine determines the engine year. The casting numbers below the distributor will determine the month, day, and year the block was cast.

    The Hornet engine also has a raised rib along side of engine, full length, about 2 1/2" inch above bottom of block on drivers side.

    Where are you located? There may be a Hudson, Essex, Terraplane Club Chapter near by.

    Thanks for sharing the pictures. Would like to see some interior photos. Probably interior better than mine. I still need to reupholster my seats and touch up drivers door panel, material came loose.

    Almost forgot, if the rear end has a cover on back that unbolts you have a late stronger mid1952 thru1954 Dana rear end. Dana has a wide selection of gear sets to choose from should you want better highway gears or racing gear sets.
    Lee O'Dell
  • Lance
    Lance Member
    Fabit, Take a picture facing the rear window. That will tell if the body is from 48-49 or the later Hornet wide rear window models.
  • RL Chilton
    RL Chilton Administrator, Member
    Good point, Lance!  You can tell it's definately not a '52-'53 from the side view, looking at rear vent window.  
  • SuperDave
    SuperDave Senior Contributor
    Looks like something I built !
  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor
    Lance
    I went to look at side view of my 52 Hornet and you can see the larger back window. Very little body between back window and longer rear vent window.
    Russel
    I agree with you it is a 53 Hornet front clip & side trim. The turn signals thru me. Then I saw pictures of 51-52 Commodores with rectangular turn signal lights like Fabit's, rather than Hornet turn signals. Do you think it might be a 53 Hornet clip with Commodore turn signals? I don't know if the grill surround is different to accommodate for Commodore and Hornet turn signals. What do you think?
    Lee O'Dell
  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor
    Just looked at some 51 Hornet photos. They also have rectangular turn signals. I suppose only one person really knows what changes were made? The Shadow Knows.
    Lee O'Dell

  • Glowplug
    Glowplug Expert Adviser
    I guess I will get myself in trouble. The body has a small rear window as well as the earlier small rear vent windows found on 51 and earlier stepdowns. Also one might think what the poster's handle means fab it?
  • fabit
    fabit Member
    I will post more pics when I can. I'm stuck at work. As for my handle short for Fabricate it. I'm a hvac tech and a old car motorcycle nut in upstate ny
  • RL Chilton
    RL Chilton Administrator, Member
    Lee-

    The front turn signals are '51.  Hood Ornament: '53.  Body is '51 or earlier.  Hood is '51 (note the center grille emblem and how high it sits up past the grille, and the corresponding cut-out in the center of the hood lip for the emblem.  In '52, this center emblem was lowered and the cut-out is less severe.  

    Side trim on beltline is '52-'53.  Trim at bottom of doors, fender and quarter are '50 Commodore (have eyebrow shape and are stainless).  

    Left Front Tire from '49 Dodge Truck.

    (Just kidding about the front tire . . . it's from a Ford).  
    :))
  • cpr3333
    cpr3333 Expert Adviser

    By some weird coincidence, I was thinking about this exact sort of question a few days ago.

    Is there a 'definitive' reference where one could go to determine what year had which features?

    For example as I understand it, the front parking lights from the car being discussed were only used in 1951 and only on Commodores, Supers and Hornets - not Pacemakers. (Is that even correct?)

    Does anyone have that kind of information in a quick reference format?  Would something like that be interesting to anyone else?

  • Lee ODell
    Lee ODell Senior Contributor
    Russel

    WOW! You have eagle eyes. I learned some difference I was not aware of. When you got down to "Left Front Tire" I began chuckling, immediately turned all out laughter at "and 49 Dodge Truck". Thanks for the humor.

    Lee
  • fabit
    fabit Member

    Here are few more pics . They are not best quality. The one of the white material is of the door panel inlay? Thanks for the help

  • lostmind
    lostmind Expert Adviser
    Looks like something I built !



    My thoughts while I was viewing the photos. " that looks like one of Daves creations"

    Looking at the last photos , it has a 50 dash.

    1950 Super? I don't see the split rear window

    Not a lot of original pieces on the car.

    Someone had a Hudson " Farm" and harvested pieces, maybe showing how he thought they should be built.

    I see parts from 49- 53 , maybe 54 if the side trim came from a 54

    Interesting steering wheel , 51? Don't recognize the color.

    Sure glad the OP sent the photos , livend up the forum a little

  • Jon B
    Jon B Administrator
    edited September 2015
    By the way, Fabit, if you happen to live in the Amsterdam area there are a fair number of active Hudson people in the vicinity.  They belong to the Hudson-Mohawk Chapter of the Hudson club.  They could give you firsthand advice, and someone may have parts for sale if you need any.
  • 50C8DAN
    50C8DAN Senior Contributor
    Reminds me of the Johnny Cash song - One piece at a time!



  • RL Chilton
    RL Chilton Administrator, Member
    Armrests are the earlier ones.  Very interesting, regardless, fabit.  Thanks for posting.  I think someone put together what they had available, or maybe what they wanted to have.  

    In all honesty, I've been wanting to take a '51 Brougham body (2DR Sedan) and turn it into a '52 Hornet, i.e., the Hornet that Hudson "shoulda" built.  Maybe someday.  
  • fabit
    fabit Member
    Thanks for info. Yes not far from Amsterdam will research. Also will get engine and frame #. When I can. I looked this am and head had 308 written on it
  • Jon B
    Jon B Administrator
    I just received the Hudson-Mohawk's newsletter.   E-mail me with your e-mail address and I'll e-mail the newsletter back to you!  XXXdetailed@verizon.net , drop the XXX before sending.

    --Jon
  • fabit
    fabit Member

    I was able to get the # of engine block it is F11958.  Also got engine to run going to rebuild or have carbs rebuilt. Any info on the engine number would be appreciated . Thanks Bill

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