Newbie member and a Newbie Hudson question...

[Deleted User]

Hello to all the Hudson Enthusiests here, great forum. I'm new to owning Hudsons, but they have been in the family (just before my time because I wasn't driving till all the Hudsons had passed out of the family and out of business). My Grandfather moonlighted as a Hudson salesman when he wasn't serving as a local Police Officer in Pennsylvania just ouside of Philadelphia. I think the dealership was called "Cornell Hudsons" and is curently "Whites Tires" I think. It was in the Glenside/Weldon area. Dad use to "borrow" the Hudsons for a little street racing in the late 50's and early 60's. All my interest comes from the stories and fan fare I heard growing up about the Hudsons and Cadillacs in the family. Now that my interest has brought me here I have a few questions I can't get answered because my Grandfather has passed away and Dad doesn't seem to remember to many of the details, so if someone here doesn't mind helping me with some of my minor detail questions I'd be very greatful.



For now my initial interest is in the 4 door 53 Hudsons. I can find a good bit of info on the Hornet, but I can't seem to find any detail on the difference between the Hornet and the Wasp and Super Wasp models except that they were a cheaper version of the Hornet. Can anyone help?



Thanks in advance,

Herbert J. Mooney III

Dillsburg, PA

Jon B

Welcome to the wild and wonderful world of Hudsons, Herbert. I am not an expert on the newer ones, but the Wasp models (and the Pacemakers before them) were a shorter-wheelbase version of the Hornet models, and had a lesser trim level as well. The engines were different too. For '53, Hornet had a 124' wheelbase, while the Wasp models had a 119'. The Hornet had a 308 cid engine, while the Wasp and Super Wasp had a 232 and 262 cid, respectively.



I assume you've joined the H-E-T Club but if not, do consider joining, as the magazine alone is worth the price of admission. (Learn more at http://www.hudsonclub.org/ ).



Incidentally, one of our members lives outside Dillsburg: Ray Albert. I'm not sure what kind of Hudson he has, though. The Pennsylvania Dutch Chapter of the H-E-T is one of the oldest in the Club, you might want to look them up to find out about local meets in your vicinity.

Unknown

good advice from Jon. Look up Ray Albert, has a farm east of Dillsburg and can tell you all you want to know about Hudsons I am orig from Johnstown, Pa. but have been in Cal since l966 and restoreing Hudsons since 1971, have a fleet of themn now, so be careful lots of Luck, Bill Albright

Park_W

Welcome, Herbert. Small clarification to Jon's reply ... while the Wasps had the shorter 119" wb, the Super Wasps shared the 124" wb of the Hornets.

[Deleted User]

Thanks for the quick replys!!!



I have made contact with the local club, Pennsylvania Dutch Chapter of the H-E-T, and I am sending in my membership app and fees to join both the national and local clubs today. I am very excited to see this kind of interest on the internet and locally in Hudsons.



I have seen 2 Hornets at the local car show in Dillsburg, PA. One is a beatiful burgandy and black car either completely restored or in mint original condition. The other is a two tone green in pretty nice condition as well. I wonder if either of these cars are Ray Alberts. I have tried for the last 3 years to find the owner of the Burgandy/Black car, but he/she is never around the car when I am. I will reach out to Ray, it may be his car.



I am currently looking for either a 53 Hornet or 53 Super Wasp to restore so if anyone has a lead on one I'd be very greatful. It deosn't have to be drivable, but it should be restorable (I can do lots of body, engine, and interior work myself). I did see a Hornet on ebay out near Pittsburgh that didn't meet it's reserve yesterday, so I may go and take a look if it's still for sale when I email the owner. Anyone local to Pittsburgh familiar with the car?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6472&item=4514260097&rd=1



Thanks again for the warm welcomes and I hope to meet some of you at the cars shows or here on the board.



Herb in PA

Unknown

Park I think you are incorrect. ALL WASPS were the shorter wheelbase, regular wasp or super wasp, check it out

Unknown

Hi Herbert,



Let me add my welcome to, as Jon B says, the whacky and crazy world of Hudson. You are going to find, as you get more familiar with our Hudson-Essex-Terraplane Club, that we are more of a big family, with all the nuances there-in, than a car club. Most of us will go out of our ways to help a fellow member - even to provideing a bed and shelter should you find need of it.



To clarify the Wasp data - the 1953 Wasp Deluxe (model 4C) and Wasp Super (model 5C) were on a 119" wheelbase; in 1954 the Wasp 6 (model 4D) and Super Wasp 6 (model 5D) were on a 120" wheelbase. The difference between the Deluxe, Wasp 6 and the Super Wasps was under the hood. The 4C and 4D models came wih the 232 engine; the 5C and 5D Super models came with the 262 carried over from earlier Super and Commodore 6's.



Again, welcome aboard - looking forward to meeting you at a Hudson National meet someday.



Hudsonly,

Alex Burr

HudsonTech - 1909-1957

Uncle Josh

Hi Herb,

Many of us will be at Das Awchst Fescht, in Macungie PA, Aug 5-7. Hudson is the featured marque this year. I plan to bring the 49 Commadore.

BTW, are you familiar with the 1/18 scale die cast Hudsons out there for about $50. Might do ya 'till ya find a full size one.

http://www.3000toys.com/catalog/item_list.asp?osql=mfg='DCP'

Larry

[Deleted User]

"To clarify the Wasp data - the 1953 Wasp Deluxe (model 4C) and Wasp Super (model 5C) were on a 119" wheelbase; in 1954 the Wasp 6 (model 4D) and Super Wasp 6 (model 5D) were on a 120" wheelbase. The difference between the Deluxe, Wasp 6 and the Super Wasps was under the hood. The 4C and 4D models came wih the 232 engine; the 5C and 5D Super models came with the 262 carried over from earlier Super and Commodore 6's."



So are all the differing answers about Hornet/Wasp/Pacemaker/etc length proof of the existance of the "whacky and crazy world of Hudson" described above? :-)



Let me redirect my question a bit. Since I am looking for my first Hudson (owned by me and not Pop or Grandpop), and I have only seen the Hornet 4 door live in person a few times, should I just look for a Hornet or will the Wasp/Super Wasp due? I love the long lines and body of the Hornet so if the Wasp or Super Wasp are "noticably" shorter body wise (I don't care about wheel base length in a car this old) I have to go with a Hornet. If the Wasps are not noticably shorter then the Hornet in 1953 (and very difficult to tell apart if all the trim was removed) then a Wasp will do for my first Hudson, but I will need a true "mark" model eventually so a Hornet will be in my stable eventually. I am also hooked on the 53 because of the hood scoop so it has to be a 53. I bet I am being a little to picky being that there may not be enough Hudsons out there for me to be choosy. Anyway thanks for all the help and advice.



I will be at the Macungie PA show, as well as Hershey like usual. I also frequent the Carlisle shows so if there is one show that tends to atract Hudsons please let me know. Ocean City MD is always fun and I show up at the 2 big hot rod shows there each year. I am sorry I missed the get together in Carlisle last year :-( I saw a picture of a really nice flat black Hudson/Wasp? in the picture section with a MD plate on it. I hope to run into this car live in person in the near future.



Well I guess I'll stop here and look through more of the posts before asking any more newbie questions.



Thanks as usual



Herb in PA

Dillsburg, PA

[Deleted User]

Uncle Josh Weathersby wrote:

Hi Herb,

Many of us will be at Das Awchst Fescht, in Macungie PA, Aug 5-7. Hudson is the featured marque this year. I plan to bring the 49 Commadore.

BTW, are you familiar with the 1/18 scale die cast Hudsons out there for about $50. Might do ya 'till ya find a full size one.

http://www.3000toys.com/catalog/item_list.asp?osql=mfg='DCP'

Larry

I really have a bad habit when it comes to dicast so I try and avoid them. I can easily spend through most of my car & car parts money buying 1/18 scale models. I always regret it, but I have been looking at them oin ebay.



"Now STOP Herb" I have to stop before the boxes start showing up on the porch and the wife makes me sleep on the couch :-( again ;-)



Anyway, see you in Macungie PA for sure, maybe even with my "new to me" Hudson.



Herb in PA

Dillsburg, PA

[Deleted User]

A good book for doing a little research is "Hudson Performance Portfolio 1946-1957" I got mine on ebay its about $20. It gathers together all the road tests done by the major car magazines of the time. It has a nice section on Wasps. I like the book because those old car journalists used to drive the heck out of the cars Hudson lent them. The tests are filled with lots of real world information.



For the History of Hudson to give you all the background that can make you dangerous at parties I recommend two books. First "Hudson 1946-1957 The Classic Postwar Years" by Richard M. Langworth which is an excellent book. And second "Fun at work Hudson Style" by HET member Harry F. Krause, Sr. which is a great book for giving you the flavour and feel of what Hudson the living breathing car company was like.



Read those and you should be good to go.

[Deleted User]

welcome. You are in the same boat as me...almost. I purchased a super wasp last year. A 1953. for 1200$ and he drove it to my house. A long story comes with it. its got 5 paint jobs but almost no rust. The rust is on the bumpers. Undernieth is spotless! The old man took care of this car. I have a few older fords all with flathead v8's and one 1970 charger with a 440 but never had a flat 6 with a 6 volt! Esp one that had a pos ground, which really messed with my way of thinking. Long story short...I joined the local hot rod club and learned alot from the " old timers" I also joined the HET club just resently. It really helps. And if there are any questions I can answer I'll be glad to help. If I don't know it I'll find out. Good luck and happy hudding! Ron

[Deleted User]

no park is right. the super wasp is 124. well thats what my super wasp is anyway.

[Deleted User]

no I thinks its 120

Park_W

Well, I'm glad to have gotten that first boo-boo of the year out of the way ... Bill is right, of course, and my "correction" was wrong. Moral: don't get the book out and scan the numbers quickly when it's TOO late at night!