Is the frame strong enough?

Unknown

Hi everyone, I have a 54 sedan that I'm thinking of getting back on the road and I have a few concerns. The rear fender wells and underlying frame are rusted out and I think they can be repaired but the skirts are missing. Can they be replaced? My biggest concern is the power train. The car has the twin h 308 with automatic tranny which I will remove and see if its rebuildable. My question is this. I have an opportunity to buy a 455 engine and turbo 400 tranny that are in perfect condition for $600 and that is an option but is the frame strong enough to take that much weight and power? Would I need to box the frame and is that even possible. I'm wondering if it might not be simpler and as economical to rebuild the original drive train. I will be doing this project with my son and he wants to do it with lots of power so he can whip his friends with their hopped up imports. I would appreciate any and all inpuy into this thanks in advance....Jim

Unknown

By the way my son is 16 and kind of nice to see him interested in the old car. It may not end up completely original but I think thats ok.

Unknown

Jim, look at the picture I posted under "Paint Stripper Suggestions". I've got a tricked- out smallblock,tricked-out 700R4 w/2300 stall, and a Ford 9in w/posi-trak. I've had no problems with the frame, or body parts flexing. Tell your Son, I've also had no problems with 5.0 Mustangs that the local kids drive!(ha)

Unknown

Jim,

BOX THE FRAME !!! Your 455 is no small block. As for cost.... You are looking at new motor mounts, tranny mount and boxing the frame and a new driveshaft, Not to mention the linkage issue. Then there is the possible rear end replacement. I just did all that to a 1938 Hudson Terraplane so I am speaking from recent experience. You may also be looking at a new radiator and mounts. The 455 is heavy too so you could be looking at new springs also. If I were you I would rebuild the old engine unless you can do all this work. If you want to see what I am talking about you can look at my project journal at hotrodders.com and look up Cole’s Journal to give you an idea what you would be getting into. I am about $10,000 into that exact same project.

Uncle Josh

If you want my 2 cents, and if ya post here you'll probably get it anyway, It would be a wonderful opportunity for your son to rebuild the 308. We're all tryin to get younger blood in the hobby, and here is a simple engine with a great history. And how far do ya wanna squawk the tires anyway.



At the shows, when people see a Hornet and look under the hood, they're looking for that big 6 with the twin carbs. When they see a 455 in there, they'll screw up their face and walk away. It's bad enough when they see my (temporary) Hudson eight in my Hornet.



Parts are readilly available for whatever you might need, and you might not need everything as these things are pretty rugged.



As to the tranny, somebody is making an adapter to mount the 400 (which ya can't see and which is a nice tranny as I had one behind my 400in Pontiac.) to the 308.



It's your car, but there's some experience, some opinion, and yas, probably some prejudice.

Unknown

I must be missing something? What are you going to "box". It's a uni-body car. Your front clip is already "boxed", as is the rear. You could install sub-frame connectors, but I wouldn't think this would be necessary for street applications. Unless your planning on modifying the rearend completely, you can't get a wide enough, sticky enough tire under the car to hook-up hard enough to start flexing the body enough to cause damage. I haven't been around these Hudsons in "all out" competition,but after spending countless hours studying the drivetrain, it would be my opinion( which might be worth 2cents on a good day) that 2 other things would give way before the frame. First being the support for the carrier bearing. (which Ken Cates website has a good fix for this)

Second, would be that even if you were to find a way to get really "hooked-up", I think the rear axle would "wrap" the rear springs, and try to pull the driveshaft out. What I'm trying to say here, is that after a certain point, all your going to do is look like a top fuel dragster doing a burnout.

Unknown

Years ago, in the 80's & early 90's a good friend of mine put a full load 460 Ford with the C6 in a '53 Wasp Brogham and drag raced it. Now, the 460 has more torque than the 455 GM products. We had absolutely no problem with the front frame section as far as strength but did change the coil springs for the extra weight.



The rear axle will not hold up!! This is basically a Dana 40 which was used in the Jeeps of the time as well and the first modification usually made in Jeeps is to get rid of the axles. We utilized a full rear frame section with coil overs, ladder bars and a narrowed 9" Ford from Curry Enterprises. The rear frame subsection is pretty easy to install if you mount it right behind the rear crossmember of the Hudson at the rear footboard. We sent the dimensions to Mark Williams Enterprises (I think) and they bent up a couple of box tubing rails for us. We also tied into the front frame section for additional rigidity and strength even though it probably wasn't necessary. For drag racing I think we used 12" wide slicks which never had any trouble hooking up. There are a multitude of street tires that width available now.



Hope this helps with your decision.

Unknown

Hi, I appreciate the replies, thank you. I recognize that I would have to redo motor and tranny mounts change the driveshaft and put in a stronger rear end, probably a ford 9". I wonder if there is a way of doing an electric shift on the tranny to simplify things or go with buckets and a center console for the tranny linkage? These things are all doable, much more so in my abilities than doing body work which I know nothing about. I am still leaning towards rebuilding the 308 if it is repairable. I could also adapt the 455 or a 350 to the Hudson tranny? Which is an automatic by the way.Sorry to seem scatterbrained but I'm simply exploring options now before we start on it. ..regards...Jim

Unknown

Jim, what you're doing is not skatterbrained at all. It's far better to know ALL your options, what all's involved with either direction, and THEN make an educated decision. Better that, than to get started in one direction, and either run into a roadblock, or worse yet.......change your mind! If you're going to go the 8 cylinderChevy motor/Chevy transmission(700R4), you will "HAVE" to alter the crossmember. Attached is a picture of my engine plate I made, the dropped crossmember, and the mastercylinder bracket I made. If altering the crossmember is "TABOO" in your book, I'd suggest you going the "original" route.

[Deleted User]

I would rebuild the 308 if possible, but if you decide to go the other route, I would be interested in buying the 308, I need some parts off it.

[Deleted User]

We Drag race our Hudsons with 440 Mopar engines but have done extensive frame mod.s and use full cages. If you go with a later model V8 and say a turbo 350 trans you can use a cable operated shifter or Lokar makes classic looking shifters which mount to the auto trans and look like a four speed shifter that will clear a bench seat.

If you go with a V8 I have an 8 3/4" Mopar rearend set up for a step down Hudson, its got Moser axles and big New Yorker brakes it already has the spring perches and panhard mount on it and would be virtually bullit proof. If your not looking for a rear that stout an A body chrysler rear fits and allows for larger tires.