Converting to a Tilt Column with Hudson Steering

rambos_ride

It looks as if I'm going to be able to leave the original suspension, brakes and steering in my Hudson after swapping in the 454/TH400.



Since I can retain the original steering now I need to address my steering wheel/steering column problem. My current steering wheel is completely trashed (only wire and bit-o-plastic left) the column is in need of re-plating (rust pitted-peeling).



So given the condition of the original hardware and the fact that I prefer tilt steering columns (to fit my fat gut behind!) my idea is to go with a polished stainless tilt column with a Lecarra Mark 10 w/billet horn ring 15" steering wheel as the replacement hardware.



Q1. What if any experience does anyone have mating a GM style tilt column to the original hudson steering box? What length column did you use? What type of adapters?



Q2. Does anyone have recommendations on a tilt column manufacturer? (Flaming River, Billet Specialties, etc.) I want a GM style with tilt, turn signal and horn only.



Thanks in advance

SuperDave

If I were you, I would consider useing a power rack and pinion. I think you will find it pretty hard to steer in tight places.Bob in Nebraska has done this on his Hornet. I believe he used a mid 80's Oldsmobile. The pump on your 454 will be compatable, useing ujoints to adapt to the tilt column is nothing compared to trying to adapt to the original box. A simple bracket attached to the front crossmember under the engine will support the rack assembly. keep it as high in the car as possible to keep tie rods as parallel as possible. Bump steer must be considered.

Good luck, DaveW(SuperDave)

dwardo99

With the small wheel, you will find it pretty hard to steer. Having said that, you have lost significant weight with your engine/trans swap so that will help. I think "Bob in Nebraska" is the guy I talked to at the National, and he used a Buick rack for his cars. I was thinking about buying one from him for my car but mine is a short WB car and he wasn't sure it would fit. If you start fooling with adapting power steering, keep us posted.

rambos_ride

The original steering wheel is approx 17.5" and the Lecarra Mark 10 is 15" - I personally wouldn't consider that to be too much smaller.



I also thought that since the steering is centerpoint and super-tight (I barley move the original steering wheel and the tires start to turn - even sitting still!) and that the Commodore was designed from the start to have manual steering - that power steering would be a "nice" thing to have but not mandatory. (I don't plan on parallel parking this car anytime soon :eek: )



Since my car was not a runner when I bought it and I have never driven a stepdown Hudson before - what are some of your guys expericences with the original "armstrong" steering? Do you Like it - Dislike it?

[Deleted User]

In my 54 coupe, If sitting still, it is hard to turn, but at anything over 5 MPH the car responds as if it has power. (Good Idea about not parallel parking)

This is My opinion

BOB

[Deleted User]

I'm interested in a rack and pinion retro-fit to the Hudson front end. If somebody has a system that works with a Hornet, it would surely be able to work in a Wasp or Pacemaker? Does anyone have the contact information for "Bob in Nebraska"? If he has an outfit that will work on the long wheel bases, I'll take a stab at fitting it to the shorter ones.



What kind of rack is it? I've just recently found a covey of "center take off" racks and was contemplating the same thing - but I don't like re-inventing the wheel if somebody else has something that will work.



Thanks,

Mark Hudson

Unknown

I was at Doc's Meet last year and was told that a Chrysler minivan rack will work in a 47 truck. I was told that you only needed to fabricate 2 frame brackets to hold the rack.



Please note that I have not verified anything about the installation as I found and repaired the steering problems with my truck.

[Deleted User]

What little I have discovered since being interested in this kind of modification is:



There are two types of basic rack designs.



One, is a "Center take off" rack. Which means the tie rods are actuated from the center of the rack and pinion body. Essentially the rack is stationary and the body of the steering unit is moved with the tie rods attached to the center of the unit. Looking at these, they more closely imitate the "center point" Hudson steering. These units were used in abundance in many different vehicles. What becomes the task is finding one with the range, pinion position/angle, and mounting considerations (space occupied, length of the entire unit - etc.).



Two, the rack moves and the body is stationary (typical Mustang II setup). The tie rods actuate off the ends of the rack, the body is stationary and the rack moves . This kind of rack would be easier to mount due to its compactness in comparison with the "center take off" units. These types of racks seem to not vary in dimention as much as the center take off racks, as far as the length and pinion position/angle, but do vary in the tie rod angle vs. the a-arm angle on compression and rebound which can have some effects on the steering (ie. "bump steer").



What is even more confusing is that both types of racks were used by manufacturers in the same model year and application being unique to the model designation rather than by year or mfg.



I guess what I'm getting at is that it isn't enough to say "1980 Chevy" rack and pinion, but one has to know it was a "1980 Chevy Corsica LS" before the type of rack can be determined.



I am in no way a chassis engineer and know nothing about IFS geometry. But I sure would hate to install any updated steering system and actually aggravates a geometry problem. I've been reading alot about such swaps of rack and pinion units into older vehicles (particularly Ford) and seeing alot of discontent with the handling afterward that goes back to what I'm worried about - changing the tie rod geometry just to make it fit.



I'm leaning towards the "center take-off" racks because it seems as you get closer to current designs, this is the type more frequently used ( am assuming this trend indicates they are better geometry-wise?). Another case of Hudson being ahead of its time in "center point" steering.



Fascinating stuff - you Hudnuts impress me!



Mark Hudson

dwardo99

I have considered the rack solution but I don't really like it due to the problem of steering geometry. I just don't know how you can reproduce the factory geometry in this way. It may well be that you can get close enough, I don't know. I have been pulling my hair out (what little I have) trying to find a power steering box that will fit in place of the old Ross unit and I am pretty convinced that such a thing doesn't exist.