question on rear ends

[Deleted User]

i have a 1950 super 6 and a 54 308 2-H 3 spd 0/D,the rear end is tired and i was thinking about running the 54 auto rear, i hear they ar better but the ration may be a bit long winded, although the high way speeds would be fast. has anyone tried that ratio? would it pull of a wadd of gum?

Unknown

gearhead wrote:

i have a 1950 super 6 and a 54 308 2-H 3 spd 0/D,the rear end is tired and i was thinking about running the 54 auto rear, i hear they ar better but the ration may be a bit long winded, although the high way speeds would be fast. has anyone tried that ratio? would it pull of a wadd of gum?

I thought someone told me that If I were to put a 54 auto rear, a 3:07, in my 50 commodore 6, that it would be like taking off in 2nd gear, which is not terrible, but having that low ratio first is terrific. Right now, I got a 4:10 in it, the 4:55 was pretty low, and I want to get the OD working, before I consider another rear swap. Best bet in my mind would be a 3:82 or a 3:59 ( I think they are the close to ratios...)



I also think that the 54 rears are Dana 44's (?) and you can get gearsets for them, new, and you can swap ratios, with some work.



and you don't have to worry about the early tapered bearing which are HTF!

[Deleted User]

is the 44 a bolt in on the 50? backing plates the same? im thinking u joints yoke etc should all be the same.

Unknown

I think so... the entire unit should swap...

[Deleted User]

thats cool,sounds like another afternoon job...lol hey get a load out of this! i bought a 50 super 6 from a guy and he had bought all the goods fro the brakes thru Kanter, when i got it half of the work was done,front shoes,hardware lines rubber and steel,master cyl and line back. but plugged he didnt have the drum puller ok thats cool, i always go in and recheck the math, do my own brakes etc,, redid the fronts,installed the rears etc etc.. adjusted up the slack, blead the brakes and had a funny pedal, i mean we blead those brakes again and again and checked adjustment. could not get a good pedal. well has to be in the master,went into that and everything looks fine humm, ok retrie it again no good. ok out with the master again and in comparing with another master i had on hand i noticed the plunger was shorter and the rod was shorter,wow, so i swapped the rod and plunger out and i had great brakes, good ole Kanter. waisted a day on that thank you

dwardo99

It will swap right in. I broke the rear on my '51 Hornet when I was younger and (a little) stupider. Got a later Dana rear from a club member ($10 back in the late 70s) and installed it on the parking lot of the apartment where I lived. I don't recall any issues. The acceleration off the line was noticeably slower due to the lower ratio of the earlier rear. I ran the $#@ out of that car. Wish I still had it.

Unknown

dwardo99 wrote:

It will swap right in. I broke the rear on my '51 Hornet when I was younger and (a little) stupider. Got a later Dana rear from a club member ($10 back in the late 70s) and installed it on the parking lot of the apartment where I lived. I don't recall any issues. The acceleration off the line was noticeably slower due to the lower ratio of the earlier rear. I ran the $#@ out of that car. Wish I still had it.

yeah a parking lot swap does not sound fun...



did you mean the rear was a higher ratio? just curious.

[Deleted User]

if a 44 has available ratios on todays shelves,what would be the perfect ratio for the 308 2-H std o/d i have in my 5o super 6 4 dr?

Unknown

I like 3:73's in my modern stuff, but I would think that anything from 3:20's to 3:80's would be nice, depending on your style...



I went from a 3:73 posi in my Tahoe to another with peg leg 3:40's and it is night and day for me. The gas savings is minimal, but there, but I miss the extra ummph from the 3:73's...

[Deleted User]

thats what im thinking is 373,should be able to get a spool out there reasonable and swap her out. then again i maybe selling this car so how about the next guy,i dont know..lol the rear is tired though so i have to do something i wouldnt want any suprises for the next guy in case i do sell her.

dwardo99

Hudson Kid, the ratio of the later Hydramatic rear was 3.08. The earlier rear was about 3.58 or something like that, so it jumped off the line better. I had done some work on that motor and it would easily spin the tires going from first to second with the earler rear but that rear will not stand up to a Hornet with a 20-something driver. Back in the day, 3.08 was a nice highway gear but I swear at the speed of modern traffic I'm always looking for another higher gear when I drive my Hornet. When I build my ultimate Hudson it will have an R700 automatic with overdrive.

Hudsy Wudsy

dwardo99 wrote:

Hudson Kid, the ratio of the later Hydramatic rear was 3.08. The earlier rear was about 3.58 or something like that, so it jumped off the line better. I had done some work on that motor and it would easily spin the tires going from first to second with the earler rear but that rear will not stand up to a Hornet with a 20-something driver. Back in the day, 3.08 was a nice highway gear but I swear at the speed of modern traffic I'm always looking for another higher gear when I drive my Hornet. When I build my ultimate Hudson it will have an R700 automatic with overdrive.

If I recall right, the final drive output for standard overdrives are something like 30% (someone correct me if I'm wrong). Are you saying that a R700 has a higher output?

Unknown

James P. wrote:

If I recall right, the final drive output for standard overdrives are something like 30% (someone correct me if I'm wrong). Are you saying that a R700 has a higher output?

I thought with the OD on the 700R4 it was only like a 10% gain. I might be wrong.



I have thought of a T350 swap for some time.

[Deleted User]

By "2-H", I'm assuming it to be a 2 lever transmission?



If it is, a 3.07 rear ratio would be really high - too high for the OD to be effective.



The two lever transmission has a higher first gear ratio, which makes it harder to take off.



I'd look for anything with a 3.73 - 3.90 ratio. If I were buying new, it would be the 3.73 for the Dana 44.



Park Waldrop gave a good site for ordering parts, and they are really helpful with vintage Dana's as well. They even know of the correct posi-traction carrier for your coarse splined axles.



If you opt for a newer ring & pinion set, you'll need some advice from your vendor on a new pinion yoke as well. The old yoke won't spline up on modern gearsets.



These fellows are a huge help, and can answer/supply parts to pull off the Dana 44 ring gear upgrades. Reasonable prices too.



http://www.reiderracing.com/



Mark

Park_W

I'm running 3.73 (gears from Reider) with OD in my Hornet (a '51, not quite as peppy as '54). Works great ... I can pull any reasonable hill in OD, which it wouldn't do with 3.58 and OD. The change was just enough to get the needed rpm and HP increase at highway speeds.

[Deleted User]

Just get a 1951 Hornet automatic rear and bolt it right in. 3:59 ratio, or get a 53 or 54 Hornet rear, 3:08 ratio and with the Hornet engine you have no worries. My 53 Coupe was 3:08 and I changed it to 2:73 and found no difference and can still fly up the hills and am getting 2 extra miles per. Open highways cruises at 90 and no high RPM's.

bigboy308

I have a '49SSClCp, 308 w/ twin H and Clifford header, standard three speed, no O/D, wife and I changed the original rear end (4.11?) to a 3.08 in about two hours time. LOVE the new ratio! You have to remember to change the speedo gear also, speedo is about 25% off (slow) w/ new ratio. FYI.

[Deleted User]

How is the hole shots?is it as mentioned earlier like starting out in 2nd?

Unknown

does any one know what my 54 wasp would have for a stock rear end. Its a 232 with no od. I have a 54 hornet I could use the rear end out of but I wonder if it would be too tall for the little motor.

54Hollywood

Jimalberta wrote:

does any one know what my 54 wasp would have for a stock rear end. Its a 232 with no od. I have a 54 hornet I could use the rear end out of but I wonder if it would be too tall for the little motor.

Jim:



All '54 Senior Hudsons; Wasp, Super Wasp, Hornet and Hornet Special used the same axle ratios. Standard tranny with no o/d was 4.09, optional ratio was 4.55, Standard tranny with o/d was 4.55, optional ratio was 4.09, Hydramatic and Borg-Warner automatic tranny was 3.07. Hope this helps.



Tim in WI.