Carbon (or oil) Buildup on Crank

[Deleted User]

OK. I have got the oil pan off, sludge out (only about 1/4 inch on the lower section. I will have a machine shop level the fastener holes and pan flange after the pan is blasted clean.



I have quite a bit of carbon build up on the crank and rods sections where they are just surfaces (not near the moving areas).



Is this to be expected? And to what degree?



I am told that the first owner/driver almost always used kerosene when changing the oil. He would drain the old, replug pan, put in 4 qt Kero and 1 qt new oil, run engine for three minutes, drain mixture, replug pan, put in new oil and new filter.



I'll try to get pictures when my daughter comes back from DC this weekend.

rambos_ride

Boy, I've never heard of someone doing this...

This cocktail - even if only run for a couple of minutes - would lower the viscosity and lubrication properties to a point I think would have caused failure of the bearing surfaces - Perhaps a spike in the heat generated with this mixture could attribute to this condition?

[Deleted User]

Ouch, same here that is not someting I would recommend either. Forget that type of thing and run a quality oil in your car and you will be fine. I have to say the amount of weird procedures you hear about is crazy. And don't anyone post any support for that procedure its absolute crap and totally unnecessary.

[Deleted User]

Understood. I WILL NOT do this to the Hudson and I WILL NOT offer the procedure as a way to clean out the sludge.



But what about the carbon or oil buildup? Should I steel brush it on the areas I can reach or leave it until the engine is rebuilt. Compression checks at 105 - 110 across al six cylinders and it still runs smoothly.

MikeWA

The kerosene (or other solvent) procedure can be useful in tractor transmissions and rear ends, to clean things up, especially if you had water in the lube and you throw in a little alcohol as well- but thats "a whole nother thing" than engines (not nearly as rapid, or high, a heat buildup). I think Dan and Rambo the Wonder Dog are right. I wouldn't mess with it, under the adage that if it ain't broke, fix it until it is (I realize that is not original material, but I won't apologize for plagiarizing someone elses stuff if it is good). BTW, Dan, thanks for making the "back" buttons work right again.

Unknown

dang it...



I just went out an drained the oil in my hudson, and tried this, now the engine won't turn over....



What happened?









anyway, al serious, I think that the kero as a flush, or cleaner would be fine, but that dilution, and running it for any time seems awful dangerous...

[Deleted User]

hudsonkid wrote:

anyway, al serious, I think that the kero as a flush, or cleaner would be fine, but that dilution, and running it for any time seems awful dangerous...

I am just passing along what I was told my my father-in-law who states he helped and it was done on many cars of that ers in that particular part of southern Indiana.



Anyway, now on to the cleaning pieces parts so they can go back on.

Clutchguy

Pacemaker500 wrote:

Understood. I WILL NOT do this to the Hudson and I WILL NOT offer the procedure as a way to clean out the sludge.



But what about the carbon or oil buildup? Should I steel brush it on the areas I can reach or leave it until the engine is rebuilt. Compression checks at 105 - 110 across al six cylinders and it still runs smoothly.

P-500,don't disturb anymore of the stuff on the crank or other areas.Make sure that you take the oil sump pick-up apart[remove 1/8th cotter pin]then use remove the cover on it,clean it throughly.Make sure that you do not puncture it.Clean the mating flange of the block of all the old gasket and oil before re-installing the oil pan.Do not use silicone when re-installing the oil pan gasket.It will allow the gasket to slide out as you start to tighten it.I use High tack,and install the gasket on the oil pan before sliding it back into place.Be extra careful when sliding the pan back in that you do not push the gasket backward in the very front of the oil pan around the main cap bolt area.These want to leak there anyway,and don't need any extra help.Don't forget to install the rubber O-ring on top of the gasket around the pick-up sump tube before you put the oil pan on also.Now with all this done,start doing oil changes a little more frequent.Also as mentioned in this forum on several occasions,you might want to consider using some type of additive.

[Deleted User]

I was planning on using Indian gasket prep. Oil changes will occur more often now that I have it. This sat for basically 15 years without one. I did a simple drain and refill before I cranked it, but my father in law drove it onto the dolley and drove it off to park it when he delivered it last fall.

Unknown

This story reminds me of the time in the navy back in the '50's I had my engine "flushed" at a local filling station. The next day I limped back to the base with three cracked rings and a cracked piston. Had to do an overhaul out in the parking lot.

rambos_ride

Pacemaker500 wrote:

I am just passing along what I was told my my father-in-law who states he helped and it was done on many cars of that ers in that particular part of southern Indiana.

Anyway, now on to the cleaning pieces parts so they can go back on.

Can you get some pics of the buildup?

The only thing I can think of wrong with leaving it is that it throws the balance of the connecting rod off - possibly causing extra wear.

I've wirebrushed some pretty bad looking gunk out of the engine valleys and connecting rods on SBC before. Then an air blower - followed by a couple quart flood of oil to wash leftovers down and not had any lasting issues.

How long til you plan a rebuild?

Would any of you suggest he pull the rear main cap and check the bearing surfaces? I'd be really concerned about possible wear - if the bearing is down to copper I'd replace them.

[Deleted User]

Yeah, I shake my head at this one. Cleaning out a tranny and rear end is fine as you are filing the case back up with oil and everything will get oiled again. But running a solvent in your engine which would remove that film of oil from parts you need to keep it from damage sounds like advice from someone who sits out in the sun all day without a hat.

Pacemaker your engine shows good compression and runs smooth so button it up choose your favorite oil and change it often and you will be fine until you do a rebuild. That buildup will do no harm. Fooling around with it could cause more problems then good. I am on year three of running my original engine. Frequent oil changes and she runs like a champ. These engines are strong and prefer little fuss.

[Deleted User]

OK. Here are the pictures. The one of the pan is after a cleaning. I only used shop towels and paper towels. The view of the crank is looking at cyl 6.



Attachment not found.



Attachment not found.

rambos_ride

Thanks for posting pictures

I think you're golden ~ This is nothing in comparision to what I've seen on other motors!

I'd say put the pan back on her and run it ~ I think my only concern would be excessive bearing wear - but one could say that about any used motor.

Hudsy Wudsy

Looks from the picture like the prior owner might have used pennzoil. Sludge suspended in a wax-like material seemed to always be an indicator. The amount you have is minimal, though. Ignore it. I recall that the old timers often used a kerosene flush. The procedure, however, was to add one quart of kerosene to the old oil and idle the engine for a couple of minutes prior to changing it. It probably was at least somewhat beneficial, but I'm in favor of letting attached things stay attached right up till it's time for a rebuild.

[Deleted User]

Thanks everyone. Y'all have been most helpful. I am nearly finished with cleaning the block so I can move to the re-install. However, the blasting shop is backed up (and closed over the holidays) so the pan will not be ready for three weeks. Oh, the pick up screen is great shape. It is soaking in a warm dunk tank to clean off the last littel bits.

Geoff

I agree - leave it alone.

Geoff.