Update: Suicide Door Hinges 4 Stepdowns

rambos_ride

If anyone is contemplating this modification be prepared for a lot of time and/or money ~ Although buying the materials I was able to save over 1/2 $$ of a pre-fabbed set - I'm closing in on about 10 hours so far and just have the hinge pocket assembly about 90% completed.

Of course I'm taking my sweet time, never having done this modification on any car - let alone a stepdown. I've probably had the quarter on and of 100x so far trying to get the hinge point as close to the outer skin as possible and forward towards the door as close as possible.

You can see in this picture how far vertical is compared to the shape of the body - very unique to a stepdown. Belive it or not the quarter fits over this without hitting on the top pocket!

The lower pocket/hinge bothers me a bit because to align the hinge placement vertically the lower pocket is well inside the outer skin by about 2-1/2"

This could present a significant hurdle in clearing the quarter since everything I've read about installing this type of hinge is the closer to the outter skin the better for the hinge point so that it easily clears the quarter.

Right now my rough guess is I'll have 40-80 hours into both rear doors by the time I'm done - although once 1 side is completed it will just be a matter of replicating the fabrication and cuts with templates on the other side.

The 1/2" extension in this picture roughly estimates the alignment of the hinge pin assemblies.

I've read shops charging people 2500-3500 just for this type of modification and I can see why - unless the car is drop dead simple there is a lot of engineering going on to make it work right.

If I can pull off the bottom hinge I'll have a door that opens nicely and without an upward swing like this car...and this car the doors don't even open all the way - kind of a waste...

[Deleted User]

Nice work Dan! Way beyond my skill level for sure.

rambos_ride

Thanks Jay!

Here's some pics from the weekends work if anyone is interested.

This picture shows just how tight the clearance is on the upper hinge to the outer skin of the quarter. This is in keeping with the advice to get the hinge out and towards the door as close as possible.

This picture shows the complete hinge pocket assembly with the hinge pin holders tack welded in. Note the 3/8 rod - this is temporary and needed to insure straight alignment of the pins.

Heres a view after removing the clamps and temp 3/8 alignment rod. The construction on these cars is just amazing - as shown in this picture there are only 5 temporary tack welds holding the bulk of the assembly in place ~ yet I can literally grab it and vigorously move the entire car back and forth and the assembly doesn't budge at all :cool:

bent metal

This is not an easy thing to do. Not because it's suicide hinges. That's not so hard, it's because of the curve of the body and the thickness of the door. If it was straight up and down, it would swing out away from the body with the hinges set close to the door skin. But, you can't set the hinges close to the skin cuz the curve of the body. That wouldn't be such a problem except that the door is so thick! That big block of door jamb area won't swing and clear the body. It will be interesting to see how you solve this. I sent you an e-mail about making the door swing "In" that I think will work well. Let me know. The only thing is you will have to "RE-DO EVERYTHING!"

rambos_ride

bent metal wrote:

This is not an easy thing to do. Not because it's suicide hinges. That's not so hard, it's because of the curve of the body and the thickness of the door. If it was straight up and down, it would swing out away from the body with the hinges set close to the door skin. But, you can't set the hinges close to the skin cuz the curve of the body. That wouldn't be such a problem except that the door is so thick! That big block of door jamb area won't swing and clear the body. It will be interesting to see how you solve this. I sent you an e-mail about making the door swing "In" that I think will work well. Let me know. The only thing is you will have to "RE-DO EVERYTHING!"

I got your email and just responded.

I think the top hinge will work just fine and you're right about the midline jog and the thickness of the jamb/quarter panel width at the lower hinge point - truly unique to this car I believe - but that will be the biggest problem ~ possibly needing a dual swing hinge as you suggested.

rambos_ride

Have never attempted anything like this, but it looks good.

I got your email on this, and I share your concerns about the rear door in the example car - it looked to me like it wasn't opening level or completely as well... No idea of a way around that, at least none that would look 'seamless' (or even 'good', for that matter).

Did see a show on "Trucks!" (Spike TV/PowerBlock) that focused on putting suicide doors on a S10 (I think), a couple of weeks ago. They had a specialist in to do the work, who seemed to take the whole thing in stride... (as always...).

I saw this show plus studied a couple of good links online that others had done to S10's

Unfortunately the jamb area on the stepdown Hudson is such a unique design, shape and size that there just weren't many ideas I could pull from the installation ~ other than the basics on hinge pin location.

faustmb

rambos_ride wrote:

Thanks Jay!



Here's some pics from the weekends work if anyone is interested.

Are you kidding? You should know us better than that:D



Thanks for sharing the process.



Matt

Unknown

That all hurt my head!



I think Lambo doors would have been much cooler.....



nice work, anyway. what you really have to appreciate is the fact that you are taking the extra steps to make it "right" and not only functional, which shows the difference in a true craftsman.

rambos_ride

hudsonkid wrote:

That all hurt my head!

I think Lambo doors would have been much cooler.....

nice work, anyway. what you really have to appreciate is the fact that you are taking the extra steps to make it "right" and not only functional, which shows the difference in a true craftsman.

Thanks HudsonKid (the money for the compliments is being wired to your account )

Personally I cannot stand "Lambo" doors on anything but a true Lamborghini. I also wouldn't want gull wing doors on anything but a Mercedes.

Could you see the old moonshiners of the day trying to hop into their Lambo or Gull wing door equipped Hudsons to run from the Po-Po?

By the time they sat down and reached up to close the door - they'd be caught!

Unknown

whaddabout a Delorean?

MikeWA

There were (are?) three guys out of Susanville, CA, who all had hot rod stepdown coupes, and called themselves "The Hudson Brothers" (even had business cards made up), and came up to a Kustom Kemps of America show in Chehalis, Washington for several years in the early '90's. All three cars were chopped, and at least 2 (and possibly all three) ran big-block Buicks. One had gull-wing doors. They looked, well, silly. Problem is, with the door up, you are hanging it out for all to see, and the shape and design of the Hudson step-down door is not all that attractive, when "on display". You need a door that is streamlined and zooty-looking, like a Lamborghini, to pull off the "look". I think the suicide approach is definitely the better way to go, and Dan is showing us how to do it right. As if any of us would ever try it.

The most memorable member of the Hudson Brothers was Norm Willingham. He has since built a killer Buick, which was in the magazines a few years ago. A really neat guy- never seemed to tire of talking about his car, and treated everyone as if he were a long lost friend. Treated even the most ignorant passers-by with good humor. Kind of looked like Wolf Man Jack. I'd like to see him again.

Unknown

MikeWA

"clap for the Wolfman, he gonna rate your record high. . .

clap for the Wolfman, you gonna dig him 'til the day you die."



Favorite Wolfman line- "If you got the curves, baby, I got the ANGLES!"

Unknown

hudsonkid wrote:

whaddabout a Delorean?

isn't that the car they had to quit building because when ever you drove it, it tried to sniff up the white line on the road????



terry