essex not charging

Unknown

went to a carshow about 40 min away last night, mostly highway driving, went to go for breakfast this morning and i noticed while cranking it sounded a little slow. while runnign i pulled the battery cable and it died. i did notice o nthe ride home the guage was kind of erratic. how do i determine if its the regulator or generator? on my hotrods i always ditched the old style mechanical voltage regulators for the ease and reliability of a newer electronic voltage regulator.



some time in the cars life someone swapped in a different charging sytem, from what i dont know? it has a 3 prong delco voltage regulator and a generator with 2 wires coming out of the side. still driven like the original, with the rubber coupler, so im guessign it has to be off some sort of hudson?

Jon B

You might want to post the model numbers of the voltage regulator and generator, here; this will help identify just what sort of setup you have.



Just a thought: are you sure that all battery and ground connections are 'bright and tight'? As you probably know, the six volt system is less forgiving of poor connections, than the 12-volt is. One reason the needle could be jumping around, is that either a battery or ground connection isn't tight -- or it's corroded -- and the connection is intermittent.

Unknown

ill check them out, i dont know where to find the number on the generator. i know the battery cable is pretty poor, i keep saying im going to make a new one with some welding lead, the ground seems ok, but i was going to make a new one for each. i could be wrong but i dont think that is why its not charging though, it still starts and runs, but i know it is draining the battery. every time i run it the guage is getting lower and lower. i didnt get a chance to look at it today other than move it in and out of the garage.

Geoff

The usual cause of not charging is worn generator brushes. However, it may be something else, but check those out for a start.

Geoff.

hudsontech

htrdhudson wrote:

ill check them out, i dont know where to find the number on the generator. i know the battery cable is pretty poor, i keep saying im going to make a new one with some welding lead, the ground seems ok, but i was going to make a new one for each. i could be wrong but i dont think that is why its not charging though, it still starts and runs, but i know it is draining the battery. every time i run it the guage is getting lower and lower. i didnt get a chance to look at it today other than move it in and out of the garage.

Generator number is on a plate riveted to the side of the generator - with Murphy's Law running full bore the plate is usually on the wrong side of the generator where you can't see it.

What year Essex you got - or visit my web site @ http://www.freewebs.com/hudsontech/index.htm

then click on "Manufacturers Numbers" - thence scroll down to either 1920-1929 or 1930-1939 and find your generator number there.



Hudsonly,

Alex Burr

HudsonTech

Memphis, TN

http://www.freewebs.com/hudsontech/index.htm

Unknown

im going outside as soon as i get my but up from this chair and im going to take a look at it.

Unknown

ok here's what i have, delco remy generator 1961H 5100, delco remy regulator 1118301 6v. the generator looks like a 50s gm unit, it has some sort of 2 bolt plate to drive something, im thinking power steering pump. they just drilled a hole in the shaft and bolted the rubber coupler on like normal. brushes look good to me, about 5/8" long and the springs still have plenty of travel left. i cleaned the commutator and the brushes put it back together and still nothing. my voltmeter took a crap so im going to have to buy another. cant i jump the regulator some how to see if the generator is working? it has field generator and bat terminals on it.

Geoff

Sorry, I'm not up with the play on Delco Remy. I recommend you take it to an Auto Electrician.

Jon B

Just for grins, I plugged that Delco generator number into Google (you may already have done this) and came up with...zilch! I thought at least we could find the specs so you could test it.



Looks like a previous owner cobbled something together because he either couldn't find the original, or didn't care to even pursue it! Maybe it worked once, but of course it's his own unique 'stew' and only he would know what the parts came from. (I don't suppose he's available to ask....?)



Gad, you've run into every imaginable problem, at every turn! You sure deserve a medal for 'sticking with it!" all these months! When you finally get this thing running right (and that will happen, believe me!), be very proud of yourself. One thing's for sure: you're not put off by a challenge!

mars55

Well, the regulator is off a '49 - '51 Chevy with a 36 amp system. I don't think you have good part number for the generator. Delco Remy part numbers don't seem to have letters in them. The part number for a '49 - '50 Chevy generator is 1102710 and the '51 generator is 1102761.

Unknown

yeah some one else told me the same thing. i dont know what to think, it is clear as day on the tag. im just going to take it to a shop and have it looked at.

Unknown

the other day i replaced the bat wire fro mthe reg to the ammeter. it was bare in spots. the car was charging after that. so i figured let me try to polarize the system at the regulator. it seems to have worked. the ammeter is not erratic. and the car runs off the generator if i disconect the battery. i have to buy a new multimeter as mine took a crap. but it seems to be working well.

Unknown

scratch that, it only worked for a few minutes.

Geoff

Just a thought, it could be dirty points in the regulator. Try cleaning the voltage coil points with a small strip of fine sandpaper. I had this with a Lucas system that was put on my '39 H8 many years ago.

Geoff.

Unknown

took the generator to the shop after work, turns out its a bosch. how was i supposed to know when it had a delco tag on it... this old stuff is still kind of new to me. anyway its not charging. guy was really interested as he has a few old cars.

Unknown

i got my generator back. for whatever reason, it got so hot it melted all the solder out of the armamture. the guy ran all of the numbers on it and they all go back to nothing. everything has a delco stamp he said but the parts are not delco and the numbers just dont match. bosch case with different arm. he said if it worked before and it works now, just go with it. i just have to make sure its not overcharging. for what it cost to repair, if it happens again, i will just switch to 12v it will be cheaper and easier for me. i have a nice brand new denso super min from a race car project that almost went on it. the size of a coffee cup.

Geoff

The usual cause of this is too heavy a charge rate causing the armature to overheat. Probably the bare wire you talked about. If the field wire was shorted to ground this would cause the generator to put out maximum charge, with no regulation. Hope it keeps going for you.

Geoff.

Unknown

well after 155 bucks to have the generator repaired and 30 bucks for a new regulator. i still seems to me that it is not charging. 6 volts at idle hit the gas and hold it, it will jump up about .01v. turn the lights on ,it goes down to 5.9 ish and turn the highbeams on and it will go to 5.88v. turn the lights off, back to 6v. pull the battery cable with it running and it dies. i am really regretting not converting it to 12v. would have cost me a lot less with the alternator i have. who knows if the guy that "fixed" it doesnt offer to help me im going to 12v.

Geoff

Do you not have an ammeter? At $155, I think you should take it back and get it fixed under service warranty.

[Deleted User]

Geoff,



Is it true that the reason Englishmen drink warm beer is that they have Lucas refrigerators?

Unknown

the ammeter on the dash you mean? it reads about -5 discharge all the time. he kept telling me i should just put a 1 wire delcotron alternator in it, and he had them in stock. but why would i need him to do that, i am not buying anything from him.

Geoff

Well, after spending that sort of money, he should stand by his work. Tell him it isn't working and if he doesn't fix it, get your money back. the Ammeter should accurately reflect the charging or discharging rate going on. I assume you have double-checked the connections, and polarised the generator?

Geoff.

Unknown

i polarized it as the instruction that came with the new regulator, bat to gen, i brought it back and he tried telling me that i messed with the regulator, tried to adjust it, i did not, then he tried to blame it on the arc marks on the screws, which was from polarizing it. i then asked is it the regulator that is bad, did you test the generator, all i want to know is that the generator is working. i didnt bu ythe regulator from him so its not his problem, he went in the back, messed around with it for a bit and came out and told me he didnt have the proper regulator to test it, he couldnt get it to work. he said it would just go to 8 volts and back to 0. so basically it was never tested before they gave it back to me. well see what happens. if he tries to charge me anymore, he will be keeping it. im not sure what i will then do, but ill come up with a new plan.

Unknown

Nowhere in this discussion have I seen a mention of the fact that some generator field coils are "internally grounded" and some are "externally grounded". ( also called "A" and "B" circuits). A regulator made for one system will NOT work in the other system. Lucas systems are all "internally grounded" while most american systems are externally grounded. Polarization is different for the two systems also.