Electronic Ignition

PaulButler

On a topic related to bringing my 112 back to life what do folks think about replacing the points with electronic ignition?

I've seen a few topics related to it on here and it seems that generally it's looked upon as being a good idea. If so then what are the suggestions? I know Val was looking to replace his a while back and I have somewhere a note of what he suggested but can I find it ....

I'd be interested to hear what the opinions are so thanks in advance!

Park_W

I was going with electronic ignition until someone told me it'd be pointless.

Seriously, the original system is simple and reliable.  Sure, you should check the point gap or dwell once a year, but that's no big deal.  I much prefer to keep it original, unless you're wanting to make it a high-performance competition engine, where extra-hot ignition is important.

Val

Paul PM me

Nevada Hudson

Jack Clifford used to have a good one.

DavidC

My 308 runs well with a Pertronix conversion, but I hear you want to have a spare on you for sudden failure.  I do not know which product would work in yours

Dave

Geoff

I have run my Jet with the original set-up for 44 years, and adjusted the points once. At least if something does go wrong with a points / coil, you can usually fix it.   Electronics go fuzzy, you are up the creek! I have carried a spare distributor for years, and never needed it.  Plugs have done 20,000 miles now.  My Essex has     had the same plugs in for over 60,000 miles.   Both cars start just fine, and no  misses or irregular running. Still on 6 volts.

faustmb

I put new points in the Pacemaker when I got it almost 10 years ago. I have greased then since, but that's it. If you go electronic, get a spare. I know a few folks that have had them fail.

KTRON

There is a lot of hype about the Petronix breakerless ignition setups. I have tried them on two engines, and just was not happy with the results, and went back to points ignition. My brother and I tried a Petronix kit on our Waukesha 190GLB and it became much harder to start, although it was advertised as having "faster starts". I figured I'd give it a shot, and was disappointed. I went back to Standard Blue Streak points and used a Petronix "Lightning" coil. It starts in a quarter turn of the crank every time, hot or cold! I tried the same on a Wisconsin V4 engine, and again I noticed the difference right off the bat, as both engines are typically started with a hand crank. You just do not get a hot spark at low cranking speed with breakerless ignition. I have hundreds of gasoline engines, and points are just the way to go. When I eventually buy a Hudson I will be retaining the points ignition for sure!

Chris

Val

Never thought of that one Ken U  Maybe I should also recondider as I am going to install electronic in place of the old points

tombia

I don't think I have changed the points in the Mallory 7C distributor in my Hornet in over 15 years. just grease the cam, oil the shaft cup periodically. If the Iranians,North Koreans, Muzzie terrorists, or a rogue Obooma administration pop a nuke over us , I don't have to worry about EMP frying electronics. My Hudson will still start and run afterwards. )

I thought this was a Hudson Forum only, Please keep your political comments to yourself I am surprised the administraters did not remove your comment

DavidC

I am glad so many are happy with their points, but there are reasons cars moved away from them.  I have not experienced any problems with starting, etc.  My 12V converted, pointless 308 cranks and starts so fast in the ice cold it will make your head spin.  I will carry a spare with me, as would the wise owner of a points car carry spare ignition parts.  But, my pertronix appears to be working very well, I can get a jump from anyone, and spade fuses are available everywhere.

Frankvintagefullflowcom

KTRON,
I had been slightly concerned that the electronic devices wouldn't produce an acceptable spark at low rpms as well, however, I just installed one in a 212 and found that I can rotate the distributor body very slowly to find the "set point" for initial start-up and it throws a nice blue-white spark.....likely superior to one produced by a set of slowly opening points. The pick-up" senses the reversal of the magnetic field as the magnets pass by and seems to be very accurate even at very low speeds. That's the experience I had with other Pertronix conversions as well. My opinion: it's not an issue.
This is, of course, only regarding the Pertronix units.
In the case of the 1362P6 kits for the S/D Hudsons, the suggestion that you carry the parts to change back to breaker points in the event of a failure is not a very workable idea since you must semi-permanently alter the base-plate during the installation. It requires that you drill out the rivets and remove the little angle bracket to make room for the sensor. Re-installing that on the side of the road might prove to be a bit of a challenge. If I was that concerned about reliability, I'd carry a complete spare distributor......but I'm not.
F

Hudson Grandpa

FrankVintage:  About three years ago I did my research as best I could. I grew up with engines and autos during the 50,s on up.  I decided that although my car is a 54 Hudson Cpe, there are ways out there to bring the operating system up to the 2000's, that equals hands off maintinence, and should run the engine more reliably.  That said, I got rid of points, and went to Pertronix. Before that I went to Optima Batteries.  No more keeping the batteries charged, because before that I went to an Alternator.  Yes, there are going to be purists out there that want points, generator, and Voltage Reg.  I am sure you are very happy with that setup.  I'm happy for you.  After installing the Pertronix with the Coil that goes along with the Pertonix, I kept the spark plug wires that I origiinally installed with the  old engine.  After a year or so with hard starting even with an alternator, I emailed Pertronix and asked them whats wrong.  Said you got the wrong wires on the car.  Not getting enough fire.  So the new wires are with the carbon fibre.  Does the car start, ____ yes.

I hope anyone does not have to change back to poiints from the Pertronix unit on the highway.  If you do keep your cellphone handy, with the nearest tow hauler, cause your going back to the nearest garage, if you didn't bring along another Dist with points, as Frank said.

If the Pertronix unit is installed correctly thats it.  But you need the Blaster Coil to go along with it,and the new spark plug wires to match, but if you still want a Volt Reg, and gen,  then you are not completing the circle.  I would stay with points.  And guess what, I am still 6 Volts Negative Ground.  Runs so good I wish to speed up the time for my next outing.  As a side note.  I used to own a 72 Chevy Van 350 with points, and Alternator.  On Sunday mornings i used to get up early to go fly R/C.  Some mornings the weather would be 100% humidity.  Would not start.  Why...I would take the cover off the engine, and uncork the dist, and guess what.  100% water.  So back to the house, get the hair dryer and spend about 15 minutes drying out the points.  Turn the key, would fire, button up, and off we go.  That was in the 70's & 80's with points on a 12 volt system.   HELLO...

Happy Pointing.......

  

Browniepetersen

I have used the electronic ignition on most of my Hudson's.  Never been stopped by the side of the road.  I guess I have bigger issues to worry about?

jjbubaboy

The only issue I had with the Pertronix is system voltage. By that I mean if its 6 volt system the voltage cannot drop below the 6 volts. The electrical system has to maintain that when the lights are on, the radio, etc. If not the car will run rough miss fire and lack power.

Once that is corrected it works great. I do carry an extra dist just in case...but have not needed it.

Jeff.

TOM-WA-

I STILL HAVE MY VCR, 8 TRAC PLAYER AND A ROTARY DIAL PHONE...

IF IT AIN'T BROKE DONT FIX IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Val

Ok after ready all the above post I am now wondering if I should just stay with a point system. If I do use the electronic system and use a new coil with it will I still be able to keep my voltage regulator and generator?

charles4d

I thought all Hudson were positive ground 

Frankvintagefullflowcom

Charles4d,
I think Gramps just mis-spoke. I'll bet he meant "Positive Earth", and yes, they're all Pos grnd, 6V systems 'til the late Hash cars.
F

Kdancy

I've changed several Studes and one Terraplane over to Pertronix. In all cases I wound up with faster starting.
Just ordered a 6v positive ground 60 amp alternator for a 51 Pacemaker. No ac or other accessories, so 6volt should be just fine. Will see how it goes.

Terraplane33

It all depends on how much we drive our old cars

It's hard to get new points here so I bought this :

http://www.gotronic.fr/art-kit-k2543-364.htm

(or google velleman k2543)

It keeps the original points but reduces the electrical current so there is no more wear except to the little cam.

It's good to talk about potential failure of electronics as it can always happen !

There is a condensor included so the original must be disconnected, it leave the possibilité to get easily back to the original wiring in case of failure. It's not installed yet.

Per

Terraplane33,

     It says 12 volts.  Were you able to get a 6 volt positive ground unit from them?

Per

tombia

My 33 Terraplane 8 has been 12V for over 10 years now and starts on the 2nd turn, I am using a 35 Hudson 8 starter, Ford selenoid, and Mopar resistor.. Engine is in excellent condition, so it does't need to crank over a lot, Also using a GM 2 wire Alt. that is wired thru the idiot light to the ignition switch assc. pole, so every thing works like it should. NOTHING FANCY ABOUT IT.and very dependable

Val

Ok all my Hudson pals, I spoke with pertronix today about the use of kit 1568P6 for use on my 39 series 92. I can keep my generator and voltage regulator and still use the kit. Also I can use plug wires from YnZ so long as they are not solid core. I called YnZ and they are copper braid. So looks like its a go on the electronic ignition for me.

PaulButler

Thanks for that Vic and everyone else. Seems there is a division as to who thinks what is best. I'm still going down the line of electronic I think ... or maybe not

Rob Fayette

I was thinking that solid core copper and braided copper would be essentially the same.  Please correct me if I am wrong.

Rojb

Frankvintagefullflowcom

Rob,
I'm sure "solid" refers to the braided copper core as opposed to a non-metallic conductor (carbon filament).
A true solid core wouldn't be flexible enough to last .......but it would make it easy to form the wires around various obstacles! Hmmmmm. Romex plug wires.
F

bob ward

I've seen the comment from time to time that one shouldn't use copper core plug wires (ie use carbon core wires) with Pertronix, but its never been explained why not. Anyone know? 

Not that anyone is using solid core plug wires on cars nowadays, but is there a difference so far as the Pertronix is concerned between a solid copper core plug wire and a braided copper core plug wire?

coverton

I thought about taking an old distributor and fastening a reluctor wheel to the top--with measured cuts of course then with a pick up from a GM 3800 and wastefire system having a more or less modern ignition system. We did build this at Wayne CC using first a mock up reluctor wheel with a dimensions machine out of plastic to get the size correct and have it affixed to the shaft where it should position. So far have not cut one from steel so the magnet will work when signaling the waste fire to fire one of the three coils. I did convert this car to 12 volt and new relays for the lights as the old wires to the "hi/lo" headlamps from the step on foot switch were all bare from age. Used a std el cheapo relay using ctc30 in 87 out and the old power from the foot sw as 85/86. Keeps the light ctc where you can see it and fused too

I do plan to do this once I get over this last round of heart fixxin at Duke HA

C Overton

BillUSN1

I did a wasted spark when I added injection to my classic Mini Cooper.

Thought about doing the same style on my new 308 when I build it since someone removed the balancer with a hammer and I will need to turn it down anyways.

GrimGreaser

For those who are unaware, a Chrysler Six distributor will take the Hudson internals(shaft, mech. advance mechanism) and only requires a minimal cut to fit the Hudson distributor bore.  You can then use a Chrysler Ignition, a GM HEI Module, or your favorite aftermarket Multi-spark Ignition Box.

Whoops - not talking stepdowns here...  Though it is possible to trigger each of the Big 3's different Ignition modules with the points in the original distributor.  I ran a HEI unit in my 52 with the original distributor.